Bee~ Journal of then...

[Beekissed]

OH, DACE!!!!!!!!!! Where have you been, girl!!!!!??????? I thought you had left us all for good!!!

How's your family??? Man, it's like old home week with BB and Dace here! I'm putting on a pot of something good and pullin' up a chair....tell me every little thing, you two!

 

[rathbone]

 

[Gypsi]

No! Thanks for posting it here, Gypsi! I didn't know about the salt in the stump thingy to discourage regrowth...where did you learn that? I'll keep that in mind for future reference.

I can't believe you have a garden going already....Texas doesn't seem all that far away on the Atlas but it must be worlds away on the weather, even though we have had one of the most mild winters on record here in WV. The greenery is confused and so are the animals...don't know if it's spring or winter here~but we're waiting for the other shoe to drop and all the buds to die from a hard freeze.

No one taught me the salt trick. I made it up. Fighting fenceline hackberries that regrew for years with trimming back and roundup. I thought of it then, but never tried it on them, I moved instead. But I'd fought those roses back for 4 or 5 years. Some people on freecycle picked up cuttings. We are not talking delicate climbing antique, we are talking the hedge around the castle out of fairy tales. And when I really needed a driveway, and we had a pretty good summer heat going, I HAD to win the rose war. So I tried it out, covering to be sure I didn't ruin the soil around it, and it seems to work. Gravel Drive has been in 2 years. No regrowth on the roses. The stumps on them were almost a foot in diameter.

We have winter crops and summer crops. Winter I start in October, November. Just onions, swiss chard, broccoli, but you can do cabbage. I've got a bit of romaine lettuce. Stuff that would NOT survive a Texas summer. I'll start putting in summer crops in March, when I get a day off now and then (obviously this is my day off, been a few days since I was on here.)

So, how long does it take for pomegranate to mature and fruit? I never knew anyone who grew them before and was wondering what you do with the fruit? Juice, jam, freeze?

I do not know how long the pomegranate will take - one of my pond customers has one that fruits - guessing it isn't over 10 years old because I don't think she's been in that house that long. I mainly planted it for the bloom, to feed the bees. I'll figure out what to do with the fruit when I get it. (adventure theory of gardening.)

I wasn't real pleased with the production breeds I had gotten around 5-6 years ago...they laid like fire for awhile but they started to die off the roost with heart attacks and looking unthrifty, so I culled them all. I don't believe I'll ever get any of those again. I seem to have more luck with the plain old stuff like RIR, White Rocks, NHs, BAs....my flock from 6 years ago is still producing strongly, though they don't live with me anymore. A farmer has them and last I heard from them they were covered over with eggs and didn't know what to do with them all.

The Bat is talking about getting a few layers here on her place, so I may go back to that farmer and see if I can lighten his load by a rooster and a few old hens and then add some new pullets to them from a local guy who is selling NHR pullets. That should get her started in the egg biz and get me back my Toby Roo and a few of my fave old hens.

What breeds were you wanting to replace with this time?

My 4 production reds now lay about 1-2 eggs a week per hen, my barred rock lays one to 2 per week, but she never laid much more . All of them nearly 2 years old. I am really thinking about the stew pot for the reds, but I need to empty the freezer out, seems too much work to cull one at a time. That or stick them on the lot, when I build another coop, but they will only get tougher with age. So for now, my Americaunas aren't laying yet - 10/22/2011 babies - I'm waiting on the cull. It is nice to have a couple of fresh eggs now and then. When the Americaunas start to lay, which should be soon, I am deciding what to replace the reds with. The feed store has: Production reds, barred rocks and black sex links, chicks for $3.99 each. I am open to suggestion - whether to order online and get something else, get a couple of reds for their huge first year output and just plan on culling at one year, but I am tired of running to the store for eggs. I eat 3 a day. I occasionally cook with them. Anyway, your suggestions are welcome.

I'll be around the computer today and tomorrow I think. Building swarm boxes and swarm catch equipment. Worked enough over the last few days to cover the mortgage, and my truck is in the shop. (daughter's truck that I bought, her rebuilt transmission was under warranty, and they have to find out what is seriously wrong with it.)

Gypsi

 

[Beekissed]

I think the initial cost of shipping a group of chicks from a hatchery is daunting but I still feel like getting the breeds you want with the production levels you want pays that shipping several times over. I can't see paying $3.99 for a chick breed you don't particularly want when you can pick breeds that are more sustainable (I can't believe it but chick prices have doubled since two years ago!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ) for the same or similar prices and just bite the bullet on the shipping.

Out of the selection you mentioned, the barred rocks are the only ones I would buy. But if one is going to buy from mail order, I'd order some Black Austrolorps, White Rocks and New Hampshire Reds....three breeds I have owned of superlative egg laying, hardiness and meaty offspring/roos for meat. Another breed that possesses the egg laying and hardiness, if not much broodiness when it's needed or meaty/heavy builds, is RIRs. Those four breeds would be my picks for a sustaining flock that will still be laying well clear up into their old age...and should actually make it to old age.

I like to keep a Partridge Rock roo to cover my laying hens...the ones I've had were smart, sweet, quiet, huge and pretty, not to mention vigilant for free ranging purposes.

Breeds I've tried and found wanting: Production blacks and reds, Dominiques( I know! Who would have believed it? My granny used to have great Doms but the ones I got just didn't make the grade...could be they've changed since the old days), Wyandottes, EEs, Orpingtons(any color).

Breeds I like but probably wouldn't invest money in again: Leghorns, Brahmas, Partridge Rock hens(too small).

Breeds I'd never even consider: Ornamentals, games, bantams, silkies.

That's just my take on the whole sustainable flock thingy....it sure works for me but may not suit anyone else.

 

[Gypsi]

I think the initial cost of shipping a group of chicks from a hatchery is daunting but I still feel like getting the breeds you want with the production levels you want pays that shipping several times over. I can't see paying $3.99 for a chick breed you don't particularly want when you can pick breeds that are more sustainable (I can't believe it but chick prices have doubled since two years ago!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ) for the same or similar prices and just bite the bullet on the shipping.

Out of the selection you mentioned, the barred rocks are the only ones I would buy. But if one is going to buy from mail order, I'd order some Black Austrolorps, White Rocks and New Hampshire Reds....three breeds I have owned of superlative egg laying, hardiness and meaty offspring/roos for meat. Another breed that possesses the egg laying and hardiness, if not much broodiness when it's needed or meaty/heavy builds, is RIRs. Those four breeds would be my picks for a sustaining flock that will still be laying well clear up into their old age...and should actually make it to old age.

I like to keep a Partridge Rock roo to cover my laying hens...the ones I've had were smart, sweet, quiet, huge and pretty, not to mention vigilant for free ranging purposes.

Breeds I've tried and found wanting: Production blacks and reds, Dominiques( I know! Who would have believed it? My granny used to have great Doms but the ones I got just didn't make the grade...could be they've changed since the old days), Wyandottes, EEs, Orpingtons(any color).

Breeds I like but probably wouldn't invest money in again: Leghorns, Brahmas, Partridge Rock hens(too small).

Breeds I'd never even consider: Ornamentals, games, bantams, silkies.

That's just my take on the whole sustainable flock thingy....it sure works for me but may not suit anyone else.

Of the breeds you like - which ones tolerate summer temps of 110 with layered shade (tin roof, coop, to get under) but sometimes high humidity to boot?

I lost my other barred rock when it was 108 last summer. The production reds all made it through the heat - like I said, I don't consider them sustainable, but for sheer egg output in a short term bird, at least they don't also get heat stroke in our normal summer temps, and they tolerated that really cold winter pretty well too..

I like my americauna roo. he isn't human aggressive or particularly easy to catch, he isn't mature yet, but so far he is watchful and not mean, so for now I'm going to see how he does. He was an accidental purchase... Fort Worth has a "no rooster" ordinance. Not likely to be an issue where I live but no sense spending good money on a bird I'll have to either cook or give away. I live in city limits, 1/3 acre (2 - 1/6 acre lots. when I say "the lot" I mean the one the house isn't on.)

Gypsi

 

[Beekissed]

I have no idea!!! Temps in my area only go into the 90s, if that, and none of my birds show any signs of suffering from the heat. I tend to think of those things, not so much in terms of breed, as more an individual health response.

Any breed should be able to sustain life in severe temps when given adequate shelter, feed and hydration... the birds that survive the extremes are the ones to perpetuate. If ALL of a particular breed doesn't survive, then I don't get that breed again, nor would I get them for living in any climate. The breeds that have a majority of birds that survive my criteria or the weather conditions are the breeds I will get again or individuals I will keep and try to keep breeding.

For any kind of sustainable livestock paradigm, most will agree that it isn't so much as a breed but the individual animal's traits that make the final cut. Some breeds are more likely to have those individuals, though, as I have found in the breeds listed above that I most admire.

 

[Gypsi]

Well, my friend with Americaunas lost all of hers last summer, in a similar shade situation. I have some stuff for her pond, I may run out and see who did live through the winter before making a chicken decision.

I like my little barred rock, but realizing I started with 5, and I only have one, the survival rate was not good - 3 to a dog
(one snatched from a child's hand when small, one escaped the run when it was under construction, the 3rd, a laying hen, hid between the fencelines when I took them a treat and put them up, only to be caught out of her hideout by my mini-dach),
and last summer I lost one to heat stroke.
I also started with 5 production reds. I lost a pretty small pullet to a feral cat which took me to 4. And I still have all 4.

Granted we HOPE we will not have another record-breakingly hot summer, much livestock of all kind suffered and died, but it is something I have to plan for. I like these little Americaunas, want to build a new coop in the shade of my giant elm tree on the lot before the heat comes on this year, but I would like a little diversity and a fair number of eggs. I should probably go back through the OT thread on BYC and look for heat tolerance. When I have time.

Thank you.
Gypsi

 

[Beekissed]

Do you give them a fan when it gets that hot? I know some folks on BYC put up misters and such. I'm with you, I'd like to find the birds that DO survive without excessive intervention and keep those bloodlines.

A couple of summers ago we had high 90s weather and I put a fan in the coop in case they needed some cooling....not one bird availed themselves of the breeze and preferred to just find some cool dusting spots and wait out the hot part of the day. I turned off the fan and never put it up again.

I also noticed they eat less in the heat, so I just cut their ration and made sure they had ACV in the water...seemed to do fine but had a hard time recovering from molt that year.

 

[Gypsi]

I have not given them a fan. I have put a sprinkler near the run once or twice.
I practice open coop/secure run - only time I've ever closed the front door on the coop the wind chill was about 10 above zero, it's well ventilated, but the birds sleep on a 4 tier perch in the run itself, under the roof, west end. (pics on my byc page). I make sure they have plenty of fresh water, and when it is really hot out, I'm usually at home so I can pull the dogs in and let them have the run of the yard to pick their favorite shady spots. Wading pool and dog pond for open water if they want a splash. I grabbed an overheating red and ducked her in the dog's bucket one day last August, she was fine in the morning, slept on the roost.

Open run, breezy except from the west (where our worst winter wind comes from) and shaded on the west end with a tin roof over the coop roof, a couple of feet of height under the coop so they can get in deeper shade, and some delicate shade on the south side, doesn't really cover, but helps. We had 70 days over 100 degrees, nights in the 80s, in a row.

I just talked to my friend the chicken veteran. What got her Americaunas were dogs - no fencing out in the country. Not heat. and she is ordering soon - we'll tack my chicks on with her order, so only one shipping. She recommended Black Astrolorp (sp) and Buff Orphington for heat tolerance, and being fairly cold hardy. She doesn't do fans & stuff - I built her big waterer with nipples, but she added pans of water for the heat too. So I guess the answer to my questions had to come local. We get extreme weather. It is what it is. Texas.

I'm going to play outside now - paint my swarm traps - I hate to have brand new plywood out in the rain without primer - and wear shorts to do it, so I can wash my work jeans. Spring in Texas is heaven.

Gypsi

 

[rathbone]

I hope I'm not butting in but... I live in an extreme climate. Summer temps are typically 120 but often reach 130.
My Austalorps and BO's did very well, as did my silkies. Meaning they didn't die. The silkies though, really earned their scratch. They were the only ones who continued laying consistently in that heat. I know a lot of people pooh-pooh silkies but they lay year around for me and they brood all my big fowl's eggs so I have a self sustaining source of meat and egg layers. I hope this helps.
Sorry Bee, I didn't mean to hijack your thread.