Complete Chicken Nutrition, No Buying Feed - How?

[bubba1358]

Or, to put it in a complete sentence:

How does one provide a complete nutrition for dual-purpose chickens without buying anything from the store?

I understand that raw milk products, free ranging, sunflower seeds, oats/corn, etc. can all contribute to a balanced diet. What would be the ideal vs. the practical? How could I get high-producing chickens without buying commercial feed, ever? This includes overwintering. Think about 30 chickens, and up to a half acre to dedicate for "chicken crops." Total homestead area is 5 acres. Portable electric net fencing is all I have right now - no permanent perimeter. The climate is Nashville/Atlanta - it freezes in the winter, get well over 100 in the summer, and the grass grows from march through November.

Thanks.

 

[mrscoyote]

You are on the right track. I think this is a question that doesn't really have an answer. My best advice is variety. Look at the ingredients on a bag of feed and translate that to real foods. I have found my chickens will eat just about anything I give kitchen scraps to supplement feed.I have yet to give up feed 100%. Good luck.

 

[baymule]

There are several threads on BYC that deal with this question. Some people grow mealworms with great success, I read of one who grew giant cockroaches. I hate those things too much to ever grow them on purpose.

 

[Beekissed]

Or, to put it in a complete sentence:

How does one provide a complete nutrition for dual-purpose chickens without buying anything from the store?

I understand that raw milk products, free ranging, sunflower seeds, oats/corn, etc. can all contribute to a balanced diet. What would be the ideal vs. the practical? How could I get high-producing chickens without buying commercial feed, ever? This includes overwintering. Think about 30 chickens, and up to a half acre to dedicate for "chicken crops." Total homestead area is 5 acres. Portable electric net fencing is all I have right now - no permanent perimeter. The climate is Nashville/Atlanta - it freezes in the winter, get well over 100 in the summer, and the grass grows from march through November.

Thanks.

If it could be done, it would be done...but it's not being done. The effort and money you would spend to buy seed, till, plant and harvest enough for 30 chickens to produce at a high rate of production(that means having production breeds and not dual purpose breeds)would negate any savings on money and time and would take up space that could be used for foraging natural proteins.

What you can do is set them up for free range on the entire area in which they can range in a day(in good forage this is about 2-3 acres..in poor forage it can mean the entire 5) instead of in a paddock. You can obtain breeds that lay consistently well(not high production)on foraged feeds such as heritage breed lines of Rhode Island Reds, Leghorns, Plymouth Rock(Barred and White), New Hampshire, Black Australorp. These are some breeds that can also go broody and reproduce their own kind each spring, meaning you will have POL birds coming into lay right when your mature flock goes into a slow down..this keeps you at "high" production in a more natural manner.

Fermenting what grains you do supplement with in the winter months, whether you grow them or buy them, can help you feed less and provide a more perfect nutrition. Foraging on your own for road kill deer(you can be put on a list), meat and fat trimmings at local home processing places and even at the local grocery store, local hunters and even through your own deer harvesting, can get you meat proteins you can grind, along with bones, to provide a lot of supplemental nutrition. Foraging for free pumpkins to be found each fall when people discard them from decorating can also yield a good bit of free foods that are incredibly healthy and nutritious for your birds, particularly if you feed those pumpkins after they have fermented and the nutrients have changed to a more perfect protein.

Improve what pasture you have by allowing full free range, promoting bug life, allowing your native grasses to go to seed several times in a season before you mow, keeping wood lots healthy and using deep litter in your coop can also be a source of bug proteins. Growing your own worms is easy and can be done with very little initial cost and can be perpetuated in an ongoing process. Growing cover crops on your garden in the winter months can keep soil and bugs where they need to be and also provide greens even during the winter...these can be winter wheat, beets, kale, white dutch clover, etc.

Forage for manure from stables, rabbits, pigs, etc. from locals and build yourself a huge compost bin and keep adding to it all year...allow the chickens free access. Make the bin big enough for the chooks to shift the compost from one side to the other and back again...keep it rich, keep it thriving.

In short, let the chickens and the property work for you, while you are out foraging and working too~but I wouldn't get all fired up about growing all your own grains for the birds~it takes up valuable forage space, you have the expense and labor to consider, and your crop may fail on any given year. Sure, you can grow some grains on your place but you can also see if a local brewery can give you spent grains, if you can barter eggs and meat for organic seed from local growers, get real well known at local restaurants and schools and see if you can remove their food scraps to add to your compost and worm bin.

High production breeds will not forage as well, will lay themselves out in a few short years and will lay themselves to death on a foraged only diet...in other words, they need some high octane feeds to lay as much as they do and they will keep laying even without the grain based feeds, become ragged and thin and will not thrive for long. Stick to breeds that lay excellent during peak season, well in the off season and take a seasonal slow down in the winter months while the young POL birds take over and just keep a cycle like that going.

 

[~gd]

Or, to put it in a complete sentence:

How does one provide a complete nutrition for dual-purpose chickens without buying anything from the store?

I understand that raw milk products, free ranging, sunflower seeds, oats/corn, etc. can all contribute to a balanced diet. What would be the ideal vs. the practical? How could I get high-producing chickens without buying commercial feed, ever? This includes overwintering. Think about 30 chickens, and up to a half acre to dedicate for "chicken crops." Total homestead area is 5 acres. Portable electric net fencing is all I have right now - no permanent perimeter. The climate is Nashville/Atlanta - it freezes in the winter, get well over 100 in the summer, and the grass grows from march through November.

Thanks.

If it could be done, it would be done...but it's not being done. The effort and money you would spend to buy seed, till, plant and harvest enough for 30 chickens to produce at a high rate of production(that means having production breeds and not dual purpose breeds)would negate any savings on money and time and would take up space that could be used for foraging natural proteins.

What you can do is set them up for free range on the entire area in which they can range in a day(in good forage this is about 2-3 acres..in poor forage it can mean the entire 5) instead of in a paddock. You can obtain breeds that lay consistently well(not high production)on foraged feeds such as heritage breed lines of Rhode Island Reds, Leghorns, Plymouth Rock(Barred and White), New Hampshire, Black Australorp. These are some breeds that can also go broody and reproduce their own kind each spring, meaning you will have POL birds coming into lay right when your mature flock goes into a slow down..this keeps you at "high" production in a more natural manner.

Fermenting what grains you do supplement with in the winter months, whether you grow them or buy them, can help you feed less and provide a more perfect nutrition. Foraging on your own for road kill deer(you can be put on a list), meat and fat trimmings at local home processing places and even at the local grocery store, local hunters and even through your own deer harvesting, can get you meat proteins you can grind, along with bones, to provide a lot of supplemental nutrition. Foraging for free pumpkins to be found each fall when people discard them from decorating can also yield a good bit of free foods that are incredibly healthy and nutritious for your birds, particularly if you feed those pumpkins after they have fermented and the nutrients have changed to a more perfect protein.

Improve what pasture you have by allowing full free range, promoting bug life, allowing your native grasses to go to seed several times in a season before you mow, keeping wood lots healthy and using deep litter in your coop can also be a source of bug proteins. Growing your own worms is easy and can be done with very little initial cost and can be perpetuated in an ongoing process. Growing cover crops on your garden in the winter months can keep soil and bugs where they need to be and also provide greens even during the winter...these can be winter wheat, beets, kale, white dutch clover, etc.

Forage for manure from stables, rabbits, pigs, etc. from locals and build yourself a huge compost bin and keep adding to it all year...allow the chickens free access. Make the bin big enough for the chooks to shift the compost from one side to the other and back again...keep it rich, keep it thriving.

In short, let the chickens and the property work for you, while you are out foraging and working too~but I wouldn't get all fired up about growing all your own grains for the birds~it takes up valuable forage space, you have the expense and labor to consider, and your crop may fail on any given year. Sure, you can grow some grains on your place but you can also see if a local brewery can give you spent grains, if you can barter eggs and meat for organic seed from local growers, get real well known at local restaurants and schools and see if you can remove their food scraps to add to your compost and worm bin.

High production breeds will not forage as well, will lay themselves out in a few short years and will lay themselves to death on a foraged only diet...in other words, they need some high octane feeds to lay as much as they do and they will keep laying even without the grain based feeds, become ragged and thin and will not thrive for long. Stick to breeds that lay excellent during peak season, well in the off season and take a seasonal slow down in the winter months while the young POL birds take over and just keep a cycle like that going.

Right on Beekissed!! If you stop and think about it the only difference between chickens and wild gamebirds is that the game birds fly better.
When the city annexed my hobby farm [and outlawed chickens] I took my cue from Key West FL and took down my fences. We have a new breed of chickens growing here in NC they are usually called gd chickens [not after me ~gd but under a name I will not print here let's just say Gosh Darned] they are smaller and tougher than meaties and don't lay as well as egg production chickens. They are eirher loved or hated in the suburbs. Gardeners hate them for some reason but others feed them either directly or by spill over from their wild bird feeders. People that love them are rewarded with eggs and maybe peeps [cats get a lot of the peeps]. There is a spring call for the city council to do something about them and I give my usual speech about how the city is a bird shelter and I will sic the animal rights groups on them.
Yep "my chickens come home to roost" and use the nest boxes and I haven't bought a bag of feed in years ~gd

 

[Justme]

You might want to check out this book. http://www.amazon.com/Permaculture-Chicken-Pasture-Basics-ebook/dp/B00BFE60Y0/ref=pd_sim_b_2 By Anna Hess. I got it the other day (mine was a free download but it is only 99 now) haven't read it all yet but the glance through she gives some good ideas.
I'm not sure you could entirely replace purchased food but you can reduce it. I know with mine - right now 8 hens, 1 rooster and 2 poulets- I dump a full bag of layer feed in the feeder and they have access to it all the time. They get to free range the entire acre of back yard. Depending on the season they get all the blueberries they can reach, garden scraps and access to the spent garden, and compost pile access. We also pile leaves in spots which then turn into earthworm haven. I grow meal worms for them and they get scraps from the meat birds when we process them and I grind up all the bones and vegis after I make stock and freeze that for them for the winter months. I also plant various winter greens for them in the winter.
How often I have to refill the feeder changes with the season sometimes it is just a few weeks, sometime it can last over a month. That is as long as the raccoon and squirls stay out of it.

 

[~gd]

You might want to check out this book. http://www.amazon.com/Permaculture-Chicken-Pasture-Basics-ebook/dp/B00BFE60Y0/ref=pd_sim_b_2 By Anna Hess. I got it the other day (mine was a free download but it is only 99 now) haven't read it all yet but the glance through she gives some good ideas.
I'm not sure you could entirely replace purchased food but you can reduce it. I know with mine - right now 8 hens, 1 rooster and 2 poulets- I dump a full bag of layer feed in the feeder and they have access to it all the time. They get to free range the entire acre of back yard. Depending on the season they get all the blueberries they can reach, garden scraps and access to the spent garden, and compost pile access. We also pile leaves in spots which then turn into earthworm haven. I grow meal worms for them and they get scraps from the meat birds when we process them and I grind up all the bones and vegis after I make stock and freeze that for them for the winter months. I also plant various winter greens for them in the winter.
How often I have to refill the feeder changes with the season sometimes it is just a few weeks, sometime it can last over a month. That is as long as the raccoon and squirls stay out of it.

Most books will tell you to feed only what they will finish in 30 minutes [except meat birds since you want them to grow fast and fat] If you were a chicken would you search all over for food or sit by the full feeder? you are not just feeding the chickens you are feeding anything that can find the feeder usually including rodents. Do you ever check your feeder for mold if you have fog mist or dew you are likely to have mold growing in the feed, In my opinion the only time they really need feed is when there is a heavy snow cover or when they are peeps. These are your birds and your money so it is up to you but think before you feed [Sorry but I have spent all summer as the Pondmaster fancy name for the guy that tells you not to feed the ducks at our local park. ~gd

 

[pinkfox]

4 standard coshings that ange about 4 acres all day, I offer then about a cup of layer pellet each evening and they seem to be more than happy with that.
ive got 5 banties that have at in the backyard (particularly forflea/tick control) they only have about 1/4 an acre to wander through so I give them a whole cup per night and they seem hapy with that.
will probably give them extra in th winter...

I don't think its possible to get comepltly off grain on anything other than full range on a good sized property...but I think if your smart about your pasture rottion, planting ect its possible to not have to feed much additional grain...
sprouting, mealworm farming, range, an growing fodder would all e good ideas, but for thigns like spruting and fodder growing you still have to either purchase or grow plenty of your own grain to sprout/fodder grow.

 

[Beekissed]

I have a flock of 14 large breed chickens who are getting a total of 1 1/2 c. of fermented feed a day...only. They range for the rest of their feed. I could even cut that down further but most of the flock are very old, so I don't expect as much out of them as far as foraging but the four younger birds get nothing from that cup and a half and have been entirely on foraged feed all summer. The older birds are foraging from daylight to dark as well...I wouldn't really have to feed them at all but I like them to have the probiotics in the FF.

Here's a pic or two of the birds that have been free ranging since 2 wks and maybe getting to snatch a mouthful of feed here and there from the bigger chickens when they were chicks but now do not even come up to the coop at feeding time because they are on a better feed...foraged feeds.

These are heritage line White Rocks and Delawares at 4 mo. of age:

And the older flock...still out foraging at 5-6 yrs of age and still producing:

And it's true...if you have a full feeder, they will not be foraging..not truly. Chickens are opportunistic feeders and if the opportunity for food is a full feeder, that is the main source of feed they will eat. Take it away and see how much they range out from that coop and truly look for food...that's when the true foraging begins. Anything else is just scratching around in the yard.

Anyone filling a huge feeder and feeding free choice in today's economy has either got more money than they have sense or they only see their chickens once a week, because I can't imagine anyone actually wasting that much feed, letting all that feed be flicked out all over the floor, eaten by rodents and wild birds and left to mold in a huge feeder before it gets eaten by the chickens.

 

[so lucky]

Well, Bee, I am one of those people who has more money than sense, apparently, lol. And not a lot of either. I feed my 4 chickens their crumbles in the morning, along with a scrambled egg chock full of eggshells. Of course they go for the egg and shells first, and sometimes don't even pay any attention to the crumbles. There is always feed left, and they scatter a lot of it. In the afternoon, I let them out of the yard to free range till dark. They spend a lot of time foraging, moving over the whole back yard and up under the pine trees. They also get table scraps and the compost pile to pick through, and a handful of scratch/wild bird seed occasionally. A bag of feed lasts me months and months. I wish I could find some feed they like better....:/