Goat people...When is the best time to sell wethers?

[savingdogs]

Okey dokey, here is the deal.

I have two does well along with their first freshening, and while I'm of course hoping for doelings, I need to finalize my plan for wethers.

My kids will be nigerian dwarf 5/8, 1/8 pygmy and 1/4 nubian, so they are essentially mini-mutt goats. I'm hoping for some flashy color or blue eyes because of the buck I used, but my does are very pretty mini nubian type, with airplane ears though, so I don't expect any nubian ears. I think they will look like nigys.

We plan on selling all wethers, and my question for y'all is this....when is the best time to sell? Newborn as bottle fed babies? After weaning? After castration? We are not anticipating getting much milk this time, but would love a few cups for soap is all.

I was intending on disbudding any and all kids at a few days old, and waiting to castrate until the males are a little older. But should I just put them up for sale first? Will I get my investment back on the castration costs (can't do it myself, never even seen it performed)?

Another question; I work for a vet that disbuds. They anesthetize them for the procedure, and while I'm allowed a discount, I work for the Cadillac of vets and they are really more into equine, not caprine, so my disbudding costs might be pretty high per wether.

There is another local vet that is more of a goat specialist and cheaper, lesser quality, I was thinking perhaps I should get better acquainted with them. I've seen disbudding performed on goats that are not asleep and it didn't seem wonderful but also didn't seem so bad. I know it sounds cruel, but I'm thinking the cost of anesthesia is going to make them more of an investment than I could sell a "mutt" wether for. I do think a lot of people are into goats as blackberry clearers in my area and many people have small plots in this county, we don't live even that near to a big city.

Should I not disbud them like I planned? It does seem that the local market pays more for disbudded goats. But if these wethers are going to end up as dinner, then it is a waste. I would rather they not be sold as dinner, but as long as they don't butcher them in front of me, I can live with it but don't want it as a goal. I've also heard that in the meat market, unwethered males sell better. I don't know how well a nigy would sell as a meat goat however.

So I'm asking for advice in formalizing my plans for these wethers, asking all of you goat experts to give me your two cents again. I've been soooooooooooooooooooooo helped by y'all in the past in making the right choices.

What would you have me invest in them before putting up my ad?

 

[Javamama]

I think I'm going to be learning to do it myself because it doesn't look that difficult. All of mine will be done unless there is a request not to. In that case, the buyer will need to give me a decent down payment because I don't want to get stuck with a horned buckling. All of mine will be registered so it can make a big difference money-wise for me.

I don't have a plan on when to sell them. I think I'll let the dam raise them and wean at 8 weeks unless they have more than they can handle. I'll probably advertise them and collect down payments to be held until they are ready to go.

 

[savingdogs]

I like that idea of collecting down payments. That way perhaps I can offset the expense of all that disbudding.

I wish I knew someone local who does disbudding besides the vet.

 

[Denim Deb]

You can learn how to do the disbudding yourself. And I may be wrong cuz I've only seen it done 1x, but I don't know that you need to anesthetize them for the procedure.

 

[freemotion]

I'm not so sure you will be able to recoup vet costs of disbudding and castration when you sell wethers....even discounted. Can you try to pre-sell them and leave those expenses up to the new owners, letting them bond with their goats by bottle feeding themselves?

 

[Buster]

I keep an eye on the El Reno, OK goat auction prices online to determine local price fluctuations.

http://marketnews.usda.gov/gear/browseby/txt/OK_LS321.TXT

Seem to spike just before ethnic holidays like Cinco de Mayo and Eid ul-Fitr. Perhaps there is an auction near you that reports to the USDA site.

I haven't bother debudding. It makes for rough handling of the big billy (sometimes I carry a shovel when I'm around him), but the others don't seem any worse for wear. I think I have had one injury to a goat due to horns, and that was minor.

Maybe I'm just lucky.

Anyway, we butcher our wethers for the table. We don't sell them. We only sell our culls.

 

[Blackbird]

We disbud and castrate our goats ourselves, it's not hard at all.
This is what we use;
http://www.jefferslivestock.com/jeffers-band-castrating-tool/camid/LIV/cp/IA-M1/cn/31073/

In the photo, the square you see at the top, that is what the band will look like when you pry it open. You simply put the scrotum in that area, making sure you have both testicles below the band area, and slowly release until it is snug, then pry the band off each of the four prongs. I've been doing it since I was about 12-13, it's a piece of cake! You should be able to find the actual bands at any feedstore. It takes mere seconds. The scrotum then usually shrivels up and falls off within a month. It is normal for them to go off their feed or whine right after, but by the next feeding or the next day they are usually back to normal. You may need to watch it for infection and spray iodine on it occasionally, just in case.

What various ethniticies do you have in your area? That can affect the market quite a bit. Supposedly if you keep the animal a buck and butcher it, it can have a bucky flavor.. Some people like that, and some people do not. We always castrate our extras that we do not want simply because they are easier to handle than bucks when they are older.
If you sell them young, the buyer can make the choice, but you need to disbud and castrate them fairly early if you plan to do so.
If you have them in the spring, they should be big enough for Eid, the end of Ramadan, if you have any Muslim or Islamic cultures around.. Then again you do have small breeds.. so I'm not sure.


If you handle your animals well, disbudding will not affect their behavior towards you.

We have a similar disbudder as shown on this page.. Not sure on exact make though;
http://www.hoeggergoatsupply.com/xcart/home.php?cat=92

After getting a horn in the crotch multiple times (it was an accident but the goat never said sorry) and having our Jenna stuck in fences for hours on end in the heat, we always disbud. An animal stuck in a fence can become frightened and easily choke themselves.

Being a first timer I suggest you have the cheaper vet do it so you know how it is done. We are complete failures at disbudding, it wasn't until this year that we successfully disbudded our kids - after having already done them once, mind you. It is a two person job, and while it isn't necessarily hard, they do SCREAM. Sometimes there will be a little blood; we put a damp rag on their head and spray iodine on to prevent infection, and cornstarch to clot of the blood and prevent flies.

There are disbudding pastes.. that's a big no, to me. Too many accidents can happen, like getting in it the eyes, etc.

Disbudding is really a little bit of pain for a lifetime of ease.

 

[savingdogs]

Gosh Blackbird I wish you were here to show me how to castrate. I'm a little more confident about trying that than disbudding.

I've actually watched the procedure of disbudding twice, but both times I did not own a goat and didn't really have much interest at the time in learning how to do it. I was merely assisting the vet and not paying heed. The second and more recent time, the goat was asleep. My boss has a big ol' disbudding iron thing he uses, looks kind of like that dehorner from that link. Doing them asleep didn't look so hard. The first time I watched, a vet did it to a goat that was awake. Also used the same type tool, this big hot iron thing, and that goat bawled and made a big fuss, we had to hold it still, but was fine five minutes after. Unfortunately that vet moved away to a different part of the state though.

Freemotion, I was wondering about advertising them really young, like at bottle feeding time, so that I could avoid spending money on their expenses. But don't you have to disbud really young? I thought castration should be done later so I could leave that up to the new owners if possible. I'm worried that we will lose money on the wethers and I'm trying to see how to avoid that. Maybe just plan to disbud and try to sell before castration time? I wish it was the other way around....since I'm really not anxious to wave a hot iron thing around.

I'm not sure of the ethnicities around here, we live an hour outside of Portland, Oregon and not terribly far from Seattle, WA. I would think that there would be many ethnic groups around.

 

[ksalvagno]

Disbudding really is more unpleasant for you than the goat. It isn't that bad to do yourself. I would have the cheaper vet show you how to do it. I did have my vet do a couple of my goats and he didn't put them under.

Banding is the way that I "castrate" males. Don't do it before 8 weeks old though. Very easy to do and the equipment is not expensive.

 

[Blackbird]

I'd love to come help you out, maybe if I head out and visit Sally this summer.. Though it will probably be too late by then.

I've heard that goats don't do very well under anesthesia.. Something about their higher body temperature? I'm not sure.

Some people like their goats having horns, some people don't.. Just a personal preference type of thing, so you'll have to choose which would be best for your situation.