Dace
Revolution in Progress
Good point about factory meat vs kibble 
So when you give beef bones are you just getting what you would for making stock?
So when you give beef bones are you just getting what you would for making stock?
Feeding your dog raw food
- Thread starter freemotion
- Start date
Wildsky
Femivore
No the bones seem to be even lower quality (nice and meaty though) - but its from a cow we bought on the hoof (1/2) for our freezer, and I asked the processor to keep all the off cut bits and pieces.Dace said:Good point about factory meat vs kibble
So when you give beef bones are you just getting what you would for making stock?
I also have stock/soup bones that were kept for us to use, the dog bones thrill the dog to bits, but they're gross looking, and we have one leg bone in the freezer in the basement that is longer than MY dang leg - its HUGE. I'm not sure how we're going to give it to her, if she goes outside to eat it, the chickens will be all over her and she won't be impressed. I need to figure that out before it gets too cold out.
We did get some ugly looking strips of fat, I gave her one or two but I don't think its a very good idea, she threw up (outside thank goodness) after eating one of those, I think it was just too much fat.
- Thread starter
- #73
freemotion
Food Guru
I've given soup bones, the kind that are cut into 6-8" pieces, have no meat but lots of marrow. I wash them thoroughly with soap (I don't want any super-bug version of e. coli on my floors!) and let the dogs have them on the livingroom rug. It is an old, patterned rug that is well-used and we...live in that room! Once they clean the bones out, they are quite clean and dry and we let them take those anywhere.
You might want to limit the marrow at first, or you may have the puking problem again. You can scrape out the marrow in the first few bones you give, scraping less and less out each time.
My older dog has been on raw for about eight years now and is doing great. My younger rescue is also doing fantastic on it, he was switched when we got him in October last year. He gained weight immediately and no longer has tear stains on his white face.
You can start your dog by giving him wing tips (not the shoe!
) as a treat, or cutting up backs with poultry shears and giving him a piece each day, reducing his regular food. Remember, they don't need as much food when they are on raw. I trim the excess fat and the tails off the backs for my older dog, as he is less active and was gaining weight. He is back to fighting fit again on one small back a day, trimmed. He was 28.2 slim pounds at his last vet visit, post knee surgery last week.
You might want to limit the marrow at first, or you may have the puking problem again. You can scrape out the marrow in the first few bones you give, scraping less and less out each time.
My older dog has been on raw for about eight years now and is doing great. My younger rescue is also doing fantastic on it, he was switched when we got him in October last year. He gained weight immediately and no longer has tear stains on his white face.
You can start your dog by giving him wing tips (not the shoe!
) as a treat, or cutting up backs with poultry shears and giving him a piece each day, reducing his regular food. Remember, they don't need as much food when they are on raw. I trim the excess fat and the tails off the backs for my older dog, as he is less active and was gaining weight. He is back to fighting fit again on one small back a day, trimmed. He was 28.2 slim pounds at his last vet visit, post knee surgery last week.
Wildsky
Femivore
Free - how did the recovery go after surgery? I'd love to know how it compares to a dog eating commerical food.
I don't really have a dog or experience to compare to - our dog was only eating kibble type food for about a year, and we switched her to raw.
She seems to me to be a super healthy girl, and I'm happy with that. No scratching itchy skin or even a doggy smell about her at all.
I don't really have a dog or experience to compare to - our dog was only eating kibble type food for about a year, and we switched her to raw.
She seems to me to be a super healthy girl, and I'm happy with that. No scratching itchy skin or even a doggy smell about her at all.
MsPony
Lovin' The Homestead
Its my fantasy to feed raw, I just happen to work at a pet store that's very anti raw. Would look weird if I went from 2 bags of dog food a month to zero...
However I got my huge, massive, ginornous lab some beef marrow bones from whole foods. He preferred it thawed, in the middle of the chicken yard, rolled in their poo. Ask me about how happy his stomach was after that...
Now my problem, is the bones fit very easily his mouth and I'm terrified he's going to try and swallow. Thoughts? He's normally good about chewing.
However I got my huge, massive, ginornous lab some beef marrow bones from whole foods. He preferred it thawed, in the middle of the chicken yard, rolled in their poo. Ask me about how happy his stomach was after that...
Now my problem, is the bones fit very easily his mouth and I'm terrified he's going to try and swallow. Thoughts? He's normally good about chewing.
Beekissed
Mountain Sage
Not to cause any dissention but merely curious and thirsty for knowledge, I'll venture an observation:
I've often read these threads about raw diets for dogs and one of the reasons most listed for switching was all the skin conditions of the dogs that were eating typical bagged foods.
I've never had a dog experience any skin problems in all these years of feeding regular dog food. Neither has anyone else I know except people who keep their dogs indoors...and some of these were feeding a rice and lamb diet at the time they developed eczema.
Could it be that all these skin conditions and health problems are caused not so much by what they ingest but by their environment and their handling? I know that dogs that are kept inside are bathed more frequently, are given flea and tick meds more often, are not able to dust regularly or develope a healthy doggy coat like dogs that are exposed to the elements.
It would be interesting to know how many of these dogs are indoor dogs vs. outdoors only dogs. Free ranged or kenneled. Groomed often or not. Fed a variety or merely just dog food.
Its very easy to blame their feed for these types of things but I've never seen this in good old country type dogs. Most of the hounds around here are fed the cheapest dog food you can possibly buy in bulk and live healthy long lives...with absolutely no skin conditions at all. And most of them are tied to a box all their live long days.
Could it be that, like the chickens on BYC, the ones that are pampered and vetted the most are the most inclined to develop illness and problems like skin diseases because their immune systems are just not fully developed and they haven't been allowed to just be dogs?
I've often read these threads about raw diets for dogs and one of the reasons most listed for switching was all the skin conditions of the dogs that were eating typical bagged foods.
I've never had a dog experience any skin problems in all these years of feeding regular dog food. Neither has anyone else I know except people who keep their dogs indoors...and some of these were feeding a rice and lamb diet at the time they developed eczema.
Could it be that all these skin conditions and health problems are caused not so much by what they ingest but by their environment and their handling? I know that dogs that are kept inside are bathed more frequently, are given flea and tick meds more often, are not able to dust regularly or develope a healthy doggy coat like dogs that are exposed to the elements.
It would be interesting to know how many of these dogs are indoor dogs vs. outdoors only dogs. Free ranged or kenneled. Groomed often or not. Fed a variety or merely just dog food.
Its very easy to blame their feed for these types of things but I've never seen this in good old country type dogs. Most of the hounds around here are fed the cheapest dog food you can possibly buy in bulk and live healthy long lives...with absolutely no skin conditions at all. And most of them are tied to a box all their live long days.
Could it be that, like the chickens on BYC, the ones that are pampered and vetted the most are the most inclined to develop illness and problems like skin diseases because their immune systems are just not fully developed and they haven't been allowed to just be dogs?
Shiloh Acres
Lovin' The Homestead
- Joined
- Jun 29, 2010
- Messages
- 970
- Reaction score
- 0
- Points
- 84
Interesting question -- the last one. I have a LOT of catching up to do.
I had one dog develop a skin condition. I bathed her 2-4 times a year, fed her a good quality food from the feed store. She was mostly indoors but spent a lot of time out too. Heartworm prevention and rabies shots -- not much other vetting. I dunno?
I have a cat that was a feral rescue who has allergies. She's been doing great for a year and back to breathing (or rather struggling to breathe) spells today. Sigh -- I love that cat dearly. She's only 2 and I hope it doesn't progress this time. She's indoor, fed a high quality diet.
But something I am wondering ... Not sure if anyone can answer this. I've been thinking for a while of switching the dog and cats to raw. I used to feed my animals homemade food when I absolutely couldn't afford to buy for then. But my pup now ... He's about 8 months old, weighs around 90 lb, and has recently started having digestive problems. His current food is a commercial chicken, rice, veggie kibble with no corn or by products. I think he's lacking enzymes. His stomach stops all the LOUD weird noises when I give him a broad-spectrum enzyme capsule for humans. I have to give him 2-5 times a week. He even had a few "accidents" in the house though he is well-trained. He just needs to be allowed to eliminate quite often.
Anyone have any ideas of the effect of a raw diet on such a condition. He's also going to weigh around 130-150 as an adult, so I really want to properly support his bone and joint health.
Thanks!!!
I had one dog develop a skin condition. I bathed her 2-4 times a year, fed her a good quality food from the feed store. She was mostly indoors but spent a lot of time out too. Heartworm prevention and rabies shots -- not much other vetting. I dunno?
I have a cat that was a feral rescue who has allergies. She's been doing great for a year and back to breathing (or rather struggling to breathe) spells today. Sigh -- I love that cat dearly. She's only 2 and I hope it doesn't progress this time. She's indoor, fed a high quality diet.
But something I am wondering ... Not sure if anyone can answer this. I've been thinking for a while of switching the dog and cats to raw. I used to feed my animals homemade food when I absolutely couldn't afford to buy for then. But my pup now ... He's about 8 months old, weighs around 90 lb, and has recently started having digestive problems. His current food is a commercial chicken, rice, veggie kibble with no corn or by products. I think he's lacking enzymes. His stomach stops all the LOUD weird noises when I give him a broad-spectrum enzyme capsule for humans. I have to give him 2-5 times a week. He even had a few "accidents" in the house though he is well-trained. He just needs to be allowed to eliminate quite often.
Anyone have any ideas of the effect of a raw diet on such a condition. He's also going to weigh around 130-150 as an adult, so I really want to properly support his bone and joint health.
Thanks!!!
- Thread starter
- #78
freemotion
Food Guru
My dog's recovery is going beautifully, but I have nothing to compare it to, this being my first dog and first knee surgery. We brought him to a new vet for the pre-op work (xrays, blood work) and she was surprised to hear about his PDA surgery when he was a puppy, since he is almost nine and doing so well.
He had a lot of diarrhea before going raw and a lot of discomfort/pain around eating. He refused to eat, mostly. His turn-around was immediate.
MsPony, do what you feel would be best for your dog, and don't worry about what other people think or how things "look." No matter what you do in life, someone will ALWAYS disagree. So what. Their problem, not yours. If someone asks, just shrug and smile.
I don't give my dogs any beef bones that they could fit in their mouths completely, and watch for ones that have been chewed enough to fit their lower jaws inside and get stuck. In the wild, there would be no sawed bones...only full-size ones.
Bee, I suspect that the reason is more complex, like the reasons that so many people are sick today. It starts with poor nutrition in the womb, and goes downhill from there. My second dog, a rescue, has a skin condition that is so much better on raw, but still flairs up on occasion. Stress is a factor. He gets a big flair-up when I clip him, but not when the groomer does it. She is fast and sure and I probably stress him out with my fumbling. My dogs are not bathed much and spend some time outside running, playing, swimming in farm ponds, rolling in the dirt (getting hosed before coming in, though!) and catching vermin. Neither has ever been tied outside. The rescue with the skin trouble is somewhat "deforemed" with very crooked teeth, an underbite, and crooked legs. I suspect a touch of very mild hip displasia, possible, as he is now two and sometimes a bit stiff getting up after sleeping. All things that can be contributed to an improperly nourished mother. Probably in a puppy mill, being fed a corn-based diet, when fed at all....
He had a lot of diarrhea before going raw and a lot of discomfort/pain around eating. He refused to eat, mostly. His turn-around was immediate.
MsPony, do what you feel would be best for your dog, and don't worry about what other people think or how things "look." No matter what you do in life, someone will ALWAYS disagree. So what. Their problem, not yours. If someone asks, just shrug and smile.
I don't give my dogs any beef bones that they could fit in their mouths completely, and watch for ones that have been chewed enough to fit their lower jaws inside and get stuck. In the wild, there would be no sawed bones...only full-size ones.
Bee, I suspect that the reason is more complex, like the reasons that so many people are sick today. It starts with poor nutrition in the womb, and goes downhill from there. My second dog, a rescue, has a skin condition that is so much better on raw, but still flairs up on occasion. Stress is a factor. He gets a big flair-up when I clip him, but not when the groomer does it. She is fast and sure and I probably stress him out with my fumbling. My dogs are not bathed much and spend some time outside running, playing, swimming in farm ponds, rolling in the dirt (getting hosed before coming in, though!) and catching vermin. Neither has ever been tied outside. The rescue with the skin trouble is somewhat "deforemed" with very crooked teeth, an underbite, and crooked legs. I suspect a touch of very mild hip displasia, possible, as he is now two and sometimes a bit stiff getting up after sleeping. All things that can be contributed to an improperly nourished mother. Probably in a puppy mill, being fed a corn-based diet, when fed at all....
Dace
Revolution in Progress
Bee, you make an interesting point.
My dog is an indoor dog, but never gets any topical meds. He get's bathed anywhere between once every 6 mos to once every couple weeks.....it makes no difference, he stinks year round.
I have a sheltie and his fur is not soft, and always smelly.
I do think there is a nugget of truth to your point....if left alone you would think that dogs would do just fine with minimal intervention on our part....but then you have folks who like to tote around poor little fido in their fancy purse and sleep with them on thier pillow.....perhaps that closeness leads to increased bathing etc.
I do know that grains are not good for a lot of people and I have witnessed remarkable results taking my own family off of grains, wheat in particular. My dog is getting older and has a little trouble moving, his hips seem to bother him, he is overweight (kind of sounds like my Hubby before coming off grains!)....and no matter how much I play with his food or *try* to walk him ( he usually sits down and must be carried!) there is just no change.
I really do believe that getting my dog off grains will benefit him. Although I admit that feeding raw is very intimidating and a little gross....I really want my guy to feel, look and smell better.
Everything that I have been reading suggests that a raw diet will get me these results.
Also, I am outside of the mainstream with my own diet and I really don't trust food manufacturers. Pet food manufacturing has got to be WAAAAAYYYYYYYY worse than the food on the shelves which I refuse to feed to the people in my family.... just sort of makes sense to feed my dog whole foods like I feed my family.
My dog is an indoor dog, but never gets any topical meds. He get's bathed anywhere between once every 6 mos to once every couple weeks.....it makes no difference, he stinks year round.
I have a sheltie and his fur is not soft, and always smelly.
I do think there is a nugget of truth to your point....if left alone you would think that dogs would do just fine with minimal intervention on our part....but then you have folks who like to tote around poor little fido in their fancy purse and sleep with them on thier pillow.....perhaps that closeness leads to increased bathing etc.
I do know that grains are not good for a lot of people and I have witnessed remarkable results taking my own family off of grains, wheat in particular. My dog is getting older and has a little trouble moving, his hips seem to bother him, he is overweight (kind of sounds like my Hubby before coming off grains!)....and no matter how much I play with his food or *try* to walk him ( he usually sits down and must be carried!) there is just no change.
I really do believe that getting my dog off grains will benefit him. Although I admit that feeding raw is very intimidating and a little gross....I really want my guy to feel, look and smell better.
Everything that I have been reading suggests that a raw diet will get me these results.
Also, I am outside of the mainstream with my own diet and I really don't trust food manufacturers. Pet food manufacturing has got to be WAAAAAYYYYYYYY worse than the food on the shelves which I refuse to feed to the people in my family.... just sort of makes sense to feed my dog whole foods like I feed my family.
Dace
Revolution in Progress
There was a recent study done which linked asthma and allergies to poor gut flora. Probiotics would likely help....perhaps just some kefir or plain yogurt on a regular basis. The thing with yogurt is that the beneficial beasties are transient....meaning they only help digestion as they are passing thru the system. Kefir on the other hand actually colonizes in the gut to fight of pathogens and boost immunity.Shiloh Acres said:
I assume the process would be the same in dogs...Free?
Also grains are so closely thinked to health problems in people, inflamation, arthritis, asthma, skin reactions etc...why should we not assume that grains may trigger the same reactions in dogs?
I really do not know much about dogs' digestion or I am simply making assumptions!
