Spare the rod......Not a bible quote

[Justsomeonelikeyou]

Children are the promise of the future. They are the future itself.
The Savior showed His love for them in Luke 18:15-17.

And they brought unto him also infants, that he would touch them: but when his disciples saw it, they rebuked them.
But Jesus said, Suffer little children to come unto me, and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God.
Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child shall in no wise enter therein

FarmerDenise is right.

In terms of physical abuse, I have never accepted the principle of spare the rod and spoil the child. I will be forever grateful for a father who never laid a hand in anger upon his children. Somehow he had the wonderful talent to let them know what was expected of them and to give them encouragement in achieving it.

I am persuaded violent fathers produce violent sons. I am satisfied that such punishment in most instances does more damage than good. Children dont need beating. They need love and encouragement. They need parents to whom they can look with respect rather than fear. Above all, they need example. I could break the wills of my little children, but this I do not do. Let the child have a mild training until s/he has judgment and sense to guide him/her. I differ with Solomons recorded saying as to spoiling the child by sparing the rod. True it is necessary to try the faith of children as well as of grown people, but there are ways of doing so besides taking a club/rod and knocking them down with it.

I recently read a biography where the author said that he reared his boys with a rod, but it was a fishing rod That says it all.

 

[Marshmallow Man]

You are spot on. That's the way we raise our kids. No bad apples yet. It's important to respect kids, but you can't just let them do what they want. They have to respect you. We always tell our kids "We trust you till you give us a reason not to". If they give us a reason not to trust them their world all the sudden becomes much smaller and less fun.

As long as parents don't abuse their children it is their business whether or not they spank their children. I just never found it to be very effective. My biggest concern is that I feel it might cause children to learn that the solution to others that they have problems with is violence.

I'm not a big Bible fan but I always thought that verse was in the Bible. I'm glad to hear that it's not.

 

[xpc]

Edited for content.

 

[Mackay]

My father beat my brother. I got to watch at times. Now my brother is a person I can't stand to be around.

I spanked my sons when they went in the street or when they lied to me. Always a spanking or any kind of punishment was followed by a discussion of why things are wrong and how to make them right. I didn't have to do it but a few times. They learned not to lie... and it left me sometimes wishing they could tell me a lie once in a while cause sometimes I'd rather not know

 

[Marshmallow Man]

Lying is one behavior I haven't figured out how to counter. When they are little it's pretty easy to tell when they are lying and take action. Telling white lies yourself can cause serious problems. Lids are pretty much black and white in their thinking and have a hard time with shades of gray. When they get a little older they know that you have no real way of knowing if they are lying unless you can prove it. Then if you make a decision based on your gut feeling and you are wrong it shows you don't trust them. Get's very sticky.

 

[Mackay]

One thing I learned when it comes to lying is not to make the punishment severe. Reward them for telling the truth even if it is bad news. Show them ways to remediate the situation without lies.
Explain to them why lying makes the world a very confusing place.
Teach them that nothing is so bad that it is worth lying about. Make them feel safe enough so they are not afraid to tell the truth.

I think lying comes from the fear that the truth is too hard to deal with... either from expected punishment and shame or not being able to know how to take care of a stituation without a lie.

Learning how to deal with difficult situations is empowering and leads to creative resolvements. Kids can learn how to do this.

I caught my son 4 or 5 years old lying about things he stole from the supermarket right under my nose. Two offences in one. Once I got him to confess that he took something he then had to go to the store manager and return the item. Then I prasied him for making things right and the store manager was gracious too. He never stole anything again. A little bit of shame and a lot of praise for doing the right thing goes a long way.

Then I taught him that when he really wanted something we should discuss it. There are ways to get things in this world without lying or stealing.

About 5 years later I went into a 7-11 type store around the corner from us with the kids... run by Arabics who watched people like hawks, put up bars at the counter like an old time bank... a very paranoid vibe

When they found out that the two boys that came in there all the time were my sons they told me that I had great kids. They never had to watch them and that I should be proud.... and I was.

 

[Marshmallow Man]

I agree. They feel like they need to lie to avoid punishment or shame. Like when they are done potty training and have an accident and you ask them about it. Or they break something and don't want you to know. If you get them to tell the truth and then punish them they feel like it's easier to lie. The way you handled your son shoplifting was great. We had the same situation and did the same thing. So far out of 8 kids we have 3 adults that turned out well. Only 5 more to go. I keep my fingers crossed.

 

[Blackbird]

Edit to remove quote

I was itchin' to post on this thread when it first came out, but I was still a minor then so I decided against it.

After living with sexual, physical, and verbal abuse for 18 years, I think there are alternatives to disciplining with physical actions that can work just as well if not better. And I think sometimes letting them learn the hard way can be the best way. Then again, I'm not a parent, so my opinion probably doesn't matter here.

That said, I would have LOVED it if I had actually done something to be punished for - and I was never spanked, instead we either got a fist or a 4 ft long board, until that broke from overuse.

I agree JSLY, most often violence creates violence (in any form) - or submission and fear, and then often creates cycles that last generations.

 

[Beekissed]

There is a very wide expanse between discipline and abuse, in my book.

BB, there is no doubt that what you received was not in any way a form of discipline.

Loving correction for major infractions is not and should not be carried out in a violent manner. One should be very careful and level-headed when using this kind of discipline. It should never be done in anger or with excessive force and shouldn't be a first resort punishment.

Some children never even require it, some rarely, some need it more often.

To make a blanket statement that often children who have been spanked as a disciplinary measure will become violent themselves is just as fallible as saying that most people who were sexually abused as children will become sexual offenders.

BB, do you feel that you could ever abuse a child like you were abused? Probably not, I'm thinking.

 

[Marshmallow Man]

This simply put, means to me anyhow, that children need guidance. They sometimes need to suffer the consequences of their actions, which might be hard for the parent to do and witness, but it is neccessary.
It does not indicate to me that children should be hit or spanked or have their a$$'s whooped for any and all infractions.

The root word of discipline means: "to teach". As in Jesus had "Disciples" = students.

Children need to be taught to be productice and well adjustet adults in a cohesive society.

Children need to learn that their actions and inactions have consequenses. As parents we need to guide and teach the children. There are times we need to say NO and be firm. There are times we need to let the child decide and fall on her face, because she made the wrong choice. As the parent, we may see it coming and stand back and let the child fall. Then depending on the circumstance we may continue to stand back, we might counsil or we might hug the child and let her know it will be alright.

I think the passages mentioned above, really are more intended to make the parent stay on course in the process of teaching their child and be responsible for their child, than to offer a simple course of action against the child to MAKE them do as the adult wills.

After all, if you simply hit a child, because the child does not do as you (the big person (adult)) wishes, aren't you really teaching your child that it is ok to hit someone smaller than yourself, if they don't do what you want them too?

I agree with you 100% Enough said.