Verticle Gardening

[rhoda_bruce]

I have a few questions on verticle gardening....mainly the distance to plant certain seeds, which I will be looking up....or DH will look it up and I can post, but I just did a search on the topic and it seemed no one had started a topic on the subject. I'm convinced that its a smart, easy way to garden and a good way to utilize your space to its maximim capacity.
From memory Momma told me to space limas every 4 feet, which seems a lot, but I normally have a very good memory. I'd imagine I can push it and go 3ft, to increase some yields, but idk.
We have planted tomatoes, cucs (2 varieties), squash (3 varieties).
We will be planting luffas, birdhouse goards, cantomelon, watermelon, limas, greenbeans.
We have also planted corn, which we will be putting cowpeas to grow up on, so thats kinda verticle gardening as well; in a sense.
We started our current garden location.....generally speaking.....about 20 years ago, with a 20X30 foot area and managed to bring a large basket of food in the house a few times a week, so it did make a difference in our food bill from the very beginning, but our current plan is taking up a much larger space and we haven't quite decided to call it quits on our expansions.
We are planting 3 metal fence poles and erecting cattle panels to these and are spacing them like soldiers in a line.
Diseased trees are coming down and being burned and hurricaned damaged.....side=ways trees are being severely pruned and cleaned of vines to consider using for growing of goards.
All this is occuring in the general area of bee hives and the panels and beds are just far enough that I believe grass can be cut almost right up to the plants, then just deweed the immediate pot or tiny bed the seeds/plants are in, rather than keep an enormous area free of all unwanted vegetation (I mean none of us are getting any younger and we might as well not set ourselves up for mission impossible).
I really think a lot of our vegetables can be grown vertically. Last year I had a few tomatoes that we hadn't set up a frame for and they trailed out all over the surrounding area and it was a mess with the grass and weeds trying to compete for the space.
Anyway, I really think we will be able to work less and have more food enter the house. Might have even designed a garden too big for our needs and have to sell or barter with some. What an awesome problem.

 

[Wannabefree]

I'm planning on a lot of vertical gardening here too, with tomatoes, squash, cukes, and gourds as well. I'm anxious to see how well it works. I'm using fence wire to grow everything up. Everything else grows vertically anyway

 

[Justme]

Are you sure that wasn't 4 INCHES? I have never grown limas as we prefer the much smaller bean of the butter pea but I've never spaced beans of any sort more than 4 inches along the row with maybe 1-3 feet between rows. Basically I put rows as close together as I can. If the variety is for a dried bean then the rows are closer for fresh varieties they are spaced just far enough to let me get down the rows to pick. Planting as close as you helps to keep the ground cooler and retain a little more moisture and helps to shade out weeds.
As for the verticle gardening YES. If it vines, sprawls,climbs go up with it. But also think companion planting. I generally will do a combo of bush green beans and pole beans seeding about 3-4 inches apart but alternating between the two varieties - two rows about a foot apart with a horizontal pipe supported about 5 feet above the ground with bamboo poles on either side leaning against it the bottomes of which rest on the planted row between the plants. Usually the poles don't go up until after the plants come up. The pole variety climbs the poles and the bush keeps the ground shaded better and give beans at the bottom.
Tomatoes do much better when staked, caged or somehow made to stay up off the ground. Be careful with the corn. Yes it does make a good 'natural' climbing pole but be sure it does't bury the corn it the process. I did that last year corn and cukes but even though I planted the corn first and let it come up before planting the cukes a few rows of the corn grew so slow that the cukes took over and the corn didn't have enough light to really produce well. Bush varieties of squash are great under corn though. And if you can allow the corn to get going good before planting the climber you will be ok.
On your heavier 'fruits' you may have to think of supporting the fruit in addition to the vine. Luffas, gourds and some squash are fine. Some cantelopes will be ok but I have had some break their vines before they we ready because they were just tooo heavy. But a simple sling or hammock or even panty hose tied to the support frame and under the fruit can prevent that. Don't think that would work for giant pumpkin though.

 

[rhoda_bruce]

I am sure that the speckled lima Momma was partial to was planted 4feet apart and did eventually take up the whole wire I trained it to grow on. I've looked for furthur backup and I'm finding multiple planting instructions. One did speak of 3 feet. One to keep the rows 3 feet apart and thin them to every foot, which looks more like what I might be after anyway because I wanted as much vegetables in the smallest space available. But I've just discovered that the variety of lima I bought is bush, so have no idea where I will be putting them. Maybe under the corn.....I guess they will appreciate some steaking, even though they are a bush variety. But DH loves limas and somehow I will get some planted on one of the panels.

 

[moolie]

Row spacing allows room for the gardener to walk and work amongst the plants.

So if you are planting more intensely (as for square foot gardening) you only need to look at the plant spacing rather than the row spacing

And if you are training particular plants upward on wire fencing, you can often get away with much tighter plant spacing

 

[Emerald]

I agree with the others.. I grow most of my garden up fencing and plant things much closer than you would expect and get great crops. I personally hate lima beans with a passion but grow several types of pole beans a year and I plant them about an inch apart and get great amounts of green beans and even dry beans later on.
A friend does grow Christmas limas up a trellis and looking at his plants he had them spaced about 5inches apart all the way down the trellis on both sides. but if you have the room to space them 4 feet go for it. They may produce well that way. I never dismiss what Gramma did! My gramma and great gramma gardened till their 90s and did well!
and on the matter of trellising-I grow tomatoes and cucumbers the pole beans and mini squash all up the fencing. I did try bigger squashes and did have to use some old panty hose on some of them so that they wouldn't pull off the vines. Oh I even did those mini Chanterelle type melons one year and they did really well. Till the deer found them.. I guess being nose height was just too much of a temptation for them I only ended up with about 6 that they didn't find.. the little gourds do well on trellising but man o man just one plant of those took over one 50 foot section of fence!
I just started the past couple of year to trim off all the lower leaves on my tomatoes as a friend suggested it to keep the blight down and it seems to be working looks goofy but last year the blight didn't take over till late in my season.

 

[rhoda_bruce]

DH and DS went on the road to go to hardware store and Walmart. I told DH to get us some heirloom vining limas, but they were out. I've actually never realized that limas came in bush varieties.....and then I go and order that very thing by accident.
Well, I suited up and got DH to give me instructions on the operation of our lawnmower and passed it around the hives. Only got one sting. Looks a lot nicer. Just got back from checking in on Daddy and told him when he is up to it to come for a ride and check it out. Told him I think I will probably be bringing a lot of food in the house this year.
For several years now, we've asked ourselves,"What if this is the year we HAVE to depend on our gardening skills?" Well, this year, we are better off than last and last, etc.... I really think this verticle gardening is going to pay off. Maybe we can read all the vegs we can potentially use before we forget something we would have preferred planting.
Now, we do square foot gardening for our non-climbing vegs and as far as I can see, its the best way to go, if you can get that started as well. Can't very well expect an onion to climb up on cattle panels. Too bad, really.
On one other thing.....it almost looks like it was part of the plan all along. Before DH started introducing all these cattle panels, he had fixed a bed of blackberries, which I had to put some fence poles and clothes line wire because they didn't bush out like they were supposed to. Then closer to the garden area we had some wild blackberries growing and I happened to have a maybe 10 foot piece of 2X4 wire, so I put some poles up and placed the wire and passed the vines thru the wire. Well its the best looking berries we have and you'd swear its intentionally to match the idea of the verticle garden....and just at the same place.
Not sure how much DH and I will be able to pull off in the next week because we are about to start our work week, but would love to hear any and all verticle gardening ideas ya'll have. We both read a lot, we appreciate whatever books, publications and first hand experience ya'll can advise us on.
Are ya'll trying a vegetable no one has mentioned? We are pretty open minded about food, so please speak up.

 

[Emerald]

I'm planning on growing out some litchi tomato this year(I've had the seed for two years and hope it sprouts) I just didn't have the stamina last year.. plus several types of Asian greens/baby boc chois. One looks like mini of the big white and green and the other is an all green version that they sell in the Asian grocery I finally made it too!!!(but that is a whole nother thread lol) I'm trying bunching onions too and have no idea what to expect.
I'm also going to try my hand at the big red radiccios for a fall/winter harvest veggie under either heavy row cover and my little greenhouse with (hopefully) a new cover or a cold frame. but I don't think any of those are gonna be willing to be trellis trained

 

[baymule]

If you want crazy producing green beans, try Thai #3 from BakerCreek. i started a thread about them on TheEasyGarden. I trellis them on hay twine so I can cut it loose and roll up the twine and vines to throw away. You and I are in very similar climate and I think these would do very well for you.

http://www.theeasygarden.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=33860

 

[Wannabefree]

Those beans are awesome! I have wanted to try some for fresh cooking. I don't think they'd can well, possibly would be good to freeze? have you ever put them up? How did you do it?