$80 organic turkey....and

[me&thegals]

Here's the thing. Even at high prices, I still get very little for my time. I could never, ever afford health insurance without getting much bigger. Can't afford nice vacations. Can't even afford new clothes. So why the heck would I lower my prices?

I don't have organic meat, but we do have pastured, and it sells for $3/lb. Just regular feed costs enough to drive our prices up. We buy 1 ton at a time, not the 1000s or more that a factory farm would be buying.

I started the organic certification process last year for our veggies, and it overwhelmed me. I have a college education, and yet I was absolutely floored by the process. I will try again in the coming year. Most people will just trust their farmer to be honest about how the food is produced, but certified organic is the only way to be sure about a lot of it. Thankfully, people take me at my word thus far. But, to belong to the CSA coalition I belong to, at the size I have gotten to be (20+ families), I am actually required by the coalition to get certified. And this coalition is so hugely supportive in marketing and ongoing education that I will try again next year just to maintain my membership.

Moolie, thank you for the last paragraph! And "true costs" are rarely factored in, either way. The cost of labor is not always/usually reflected in the price of local food. And the price of contamination, pollution, and below-cost-of-living wages for employees are not shown in factory farm food. Kind of like Wal-Mart--you (the generic you) get their goods cheaply, but have you factored in your tax dollars going to provide their employees with state-subsidized health insurance since WM doesn't provide it and they earn so little that they qualify?

Here's another example. In our chaotic mid-summer, we got meat chickens. Due to always being somewhere else, it took us a while to realize a chicken hawk was devastating our pastured bird population. It's lovely for our customers that their birds are pastured, but it ended up being an enormous cost to us. We lost 50 out of 120 birds. Our income was just slashed despite much of the cost already invested in those birds.

 

[Beekissed]

I would counter your question above with another: how in the world are farmers and other food producers supposed to feed their families if people aren't willing to pay the true cost of food? People on this forum are always complaining about sending jobs out of America, yet unwilling to pay the true costs of supporting local producers. That dichotomy is something I just can't wrap my brain around. That's what I call "ridiculous".

I'm not one of those people! I grow my own and I don't even buy the "cheap" chicken in the stores that are massed produced. I don't support the local farmers because, in a small way, I already ARE one. I can't afford to NOT grow my own, whereas you seem to be able to afford to pay for someone to grow yours for you, even at the prices mentioned.


It's all a trade off really~ six of one, half dozen of the other. You probably wouldn't live in my area and grow your own more cheaply because the wages here are very low. I wouldn't live in your area and pull down a higher wage so that I could afford to pay another to grow my food.

It's all relative.

 

[me&thegals]

Because we are the type of people who would just grow our own before we payed those high prices. It is hard to wrap my mind around anyone paying $20 for one single chicken when it takes a mere fraction of that for me to raise one. How in the world could they afford to feed their families if they are paying that much for a single bird that would be just a portion of one meal for a family of four?

That $20 chicken feeds my family of 4 quite nicely, with leftovers for sandwiches plus soup bones--that's 3 meals.

We get even more out of ours When we use a 7 pounder, we get the first meal roasted. The meat leftovers go into a potpie for 2-4 more meals (depending which size pan I use and how many veggies I add in). The rest is simmered into soup that can go for at least another 3-4 meals.

I actually have a document I send with the chickens called "Chicken Yoga: Or How to Stretch a Chicken" to describe this process and recipes for each of them

So, even a $20-chicken becomes seriously inexpensive for a family of 4 if they can make it last 6-9 meals.

 

[Marianne]

Chicken yoga....

Well, I have to admit that I'm really hoping SIL gets a free turkey from work. He changed jobs, so he probably doesn't even know. If he doesn't, I'll get the el cheapo one from the local market. At this point, price dictates what I buy.

Interesting thread.

 

[moolie]

...so that I could afford to pay another to grow my food.

Is that what you seriously think?

I live where I do because it's what I know, it's my home.

I would suspect the same is true for you. I don't live here so I don't have to do what you do. I'd love to have more self-sufficiency than what is presently available to me, but I can't. I can't afford more land, or to move somewhere else where land is cheaper until my mortgage is paid off and my kids are done school. I have friends who are farmers and they can't afford to change their lifestyle any more than I can. We each have a place in society, and if my hubs didn't do what he does, you can bet your boots it would affect a lot of people's lives--he works with computers and keeps certain vital systems running.

Moolie, thank you for the last paragraph! And "true costs" are rarely factored in, either way. The cost of labor is not always/usually reflected in the price of local food. And the price of contamination, pollution, and below-cost-of-living wages for employees are not shown in factory farm food. Kind of like Wal-Mart--you (the generic you) get their goods cheaply, but have you factored in your tax dollars going to provide their employees with state-subsidized health insurance since WM doesn't provide it and they earn so little that they qualify?

Here's another example. In our chaotic mid-summer, we got meat chickens. Due to always being somewhere else, it took us a while to realize a chicken hawk was devastating our pastured bird population. It's lovely for our customers that their birds are pastured, but it ended up being an enormous cost to us. We lost 50 out of 120 birds. Our income was just slashed despite much of the cost already invested in those birds.

We choose not to shop at places like Wal-Mart, I know you said "generic" you, but we truly put feet to our personal beliefs. Both my husband and myself are self-employed, we don't have benefits either. And we know from first-hand experience how difficult it is to get people to pay full price. Hubs is fortunate that he works as a contractor in IT so gets paid pretty well, but what I do isn't valued to the degree that it should be based on the time and talent I put into put in plus my cost of goods.

Very sorry to hear about your birds, and hope it's not catastrophic to your year --I had a terrible 2010 and am still trying to get back from it, wouldn't wish that on anyone.

 

[moolie]

We get even more out of ours When we use a 7 pounder, we get the first meal roasted. The meat leftovers go into a potpie for 2-4 more meals (depending which size pan I use and how many veggies I add in). The rest is simmered into soup that can go for at least another 3-4 meals.

I actually have a document I send with the chickens called "Chicken Yoga: Or How to Stretch a Chicken" to describe this process and recipes for each of them

So, even a $20-chicken becomes seriously inexpensive for a family of 4 if they can make it last 6-9 meals.

Totally depends on the size of the chicken. Prices have gone up lately, so a $20 chicken is smaller than it used to be around here. We used to be able to eat for more than a week off that $20, but not today.

 

[ORChick]

This fellow, raising pigs in Scotland, has written more than once on this subject. He has an interesting blog; I recommend it.

http://stoneheadcroft.com/2011/03/02/calculating-the-cost-of-pork/

 

[me&thegals]

Thanks, Moolie I think it will just be a break-even bird year. DH spent 2 days under an awning in cold, rainy weather butchering the birds, so it was a huge cost for him. I bought him a mushroom guidebook in sheer gratitude.

We had a rollercoaster year. The CSA business is paid-ahead income and very appreciated. My customers pay me up front, put their faith in me and accept what I provide them. Contrary to possible popular belief, this makes me even MORE committed to them, I'm so careful in not breaking that trust!

The farmer's markets started off awesome, divebombed in midsummer, and then ended phenomenally well. I tell people how much we count on them. I found myself thanking customers even more gratefully when things started to get better. I have worked my butt off since March to grow this food. I've sweated in 100-degree weather with a heat index even higher, I've frozen myself stiff the past month in the wind, cold and bitterly cold washing water. Either way, I've worked incredibly hard. It's painful to work that hard and have crummy markets. It's worth it to work that hard and have excellent markets. I guess I need a tougher skin. The bad markets really get to me.

So very true Moolie about interdependence. I love my life and wouldn't exchange it with someone else's, but I sure appreciate what they do! I have my laptop back in great working condition thanks to all those people at Best Buy. You couldn't pay me to do their job, and I bet they wouldn't do mine for all the world.

I had a customer (photographer) post an entire blog posting on the veggies I grew for her last week The photos are gorgeous! And then she did a tutorial on how to make borscht that she passed on to all her fellow CSA customers. I adore her for that! Her skill in photography is enviable. And she apparently appreciates my work in growing vegetables. What a wonderful world where we each appreciate each other's skills, even if we don't care to learn them ourselves and vice versa.

 

[me&thegals]

Totally depends on the size of the chicken. Prices have gone up lately, so a $20 chicken is smaller than it used to be around here. We used to be able to eat for more than a week off that $20, but not today.

True--I was referring to my 7-pounder at $3/lb.

 

[Beekissed]

I would suspect the same is true for you

Nope. If I yearned to live elsewhere, I'd take the necessary steps to live there. If Iived in the city and yearned to have acreage, I'd sell my house in the city and buy or rent in the country. Life is short and waiting until some distant point in the future where you will be able to finally afford to move seems silly to me....particularly if I was paying $20 for a chicken and I really just wanted to be able to raise my own.

People have different priorities and that's okay. It's also okay to wonder how folks can afford this or that when you cannot. Thats called a discussion. Like when city folks say they'd never live in a place that didn't have cell reception or where the nearest fast food or Walmart is 50 miles away and they think people are crazy to live there.