reinbeau
Moderator Extraordinaire
Now who is having a Svengali moment? Who here on this thread had once implied that 'it's all about me'? Sweeping generalizations aren't just made by those with more conservative viewpoints.patandchickens said:
Obama will be speaking to all the school children of America this week
- Thread starter MorelCabin
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patandchickens
Crazy Cat Lady
Let me be clear.reinbeau said:
"You believe it's all about me" is different than "I don't believe it's all about me".
I am EXPLAINING MY OWN VIEWPOINT here. Not telling anyone else what theirs is.
Man.
(e.t.a. -- Plus, pardon me for exercising a pet peeve here, but Svengali (the fictional character) was not engaged in mind READING, he was engaged in mind CONTROL, so the reference is really pretty misplaced)
Pat
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MorelCabin
Quilting Extraordinaire
Ummm, I spent 5 years of my life hanging out in Welfare lines...swore it wasn't going to ever get the best of me, and it didn't. Spent some time in the food bank line up as well:>) Now my DD is hanging out in the welfare lines temporarily...swearing it won't get the best of her either, and wouldn't you know it, nothing has changed, she sees the same things I saw back then. Girls getting pregnant again and again to be able to collect more...heck I had an old friend who was trying to get preggo at 40 because her youngest was turning 16 and she needed to be able to stay on. Girls who pass each other in the welfare line asking who the daddy's are because many of them share the same...you have to live it to believe it. And yes, went through a few boyfriends back then who beat the tar out of me and drank my welfare check.me&thegals said:
You want to know about welfare lines, I have three friends who work there, they all say the same thing...generational welfare is whrer it's at, really. Our government has only succeeded in inventing a whole new culture when they came up with the system
I've lived in both worlds...not predjudiced by any means...and ALWAYS had the same convictions. I've hung out with many many people on both sides, I think I know the mentality.
If there hadn't been welfare back then I think I would have survived anyhow, it would have meant facing my parents and living by thier rules instead of mine, helping out at home and working while my mother babysat. Probably would have kept me out of a whole lot of trouble in the long run. So is taking from the rich the answer? No it's not.
FarmerChick
Super Self-Sufficient
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Sounds to me like Morel sure has seen both sides of the lines!
And in all the years....nothing has changed.
That is the problem. Nothing has changed. More and more money pumped into a failing system.
That is the TRUE problem.
Morel has shown you an answer and one thing is clear....nothing is changing. How long can we "not change"?
It doesn't work. We must change truly. Again, unbelievably hard to do but must be done and without losing our basic rights that were established in this nation.
And in all the years....nothing has changed.
That is the problem. Nothing has changed. More and more money pumped into a failing system.
That is the TRUE problem.
Morel has shown you an answer and one thing is clear....nothing is changing. How long can we "not change"?
It doesn't work. We must change truly. Again, unbelievably hard to do but must be done and without losing our basic rights that were established in this nation.
patandchickens
Crazy Cat Lady
Look, just answer me one question. I *am* actually trying to understand where y'all are coming from.
Since the system *already* takes more (proportionately) from the well off than from the poor, and has done so pretty much since the US was founded, how is this an Obama-specific issue, other than the fact that he belongs to a group of people (largely a.k.a. 'the Democratic Party') who lean oppositely on the issue than you do?
Pat
Since the system *already* takes more (proportionately) from the well off than from the poor, and has done so pretty much since the US was founded, how is this an Obama-specific issue, other than the fact that he belongs to a group of people (largely a.k.a. 'the Democratic Party') who lean oppositely on the issue than you do?
Pat
FarmerChick
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reinbeau wrote:
the thought of 'redistribution of wealth' <snip>Sorry, I do not feel safe with such a man at the helm of our government.
Then Pat answered: Well there ya go, then, it just goes to show that there are different sorts of people in the world.
Because, *I* don't feel safe with someone at the helm of the government who does NOT believe in redistributing wealth to some reasonable degree.
Being as how some people have massively stupidly more than anyone needs and are not using it as (IMO) honor and decency demand to help those who are SERIOUSLY having trouble getting through life at all.
BTW I say this as not really belonging to either group, except insofar as even the poorest Americans are living hugely better than hundreds of millions of people who happened to be born elsewhere on the globe.
___________
It is not Obama specific to me.
We started with Obama and his speech and then a few commented about stepping on constutional rights and Ann mentioned the redistrubtion of wealth and you answered and we all snowballed from there...LOL
It isn't an Obama issue because every Pres. before has still not even tackled the govt. problems at their roots.
But being that he is Pres. currently, yea we dragged him into it..LOL---but of course he is facing those battles right now in his term.
And then some say take more money from the wealthy to help fund the nation and others say do not take more money from only the wealthy.
you know, back and forth stuff!!
the thought of 'redistribution of wealth' <snip>Sorry, I do not feel safe with such a man at the helm of our government.
Then Pat answered: Well there ya go, then, it just goes to show that there are different sorts of people in the world.
Because, *I* don't feel safe with someone at the helm of the government who does NOT believe in redistributing wealth to some reasonable degree.
Being as how some people have massively stupidly more than anyone needs and are not using it as (IMO) honor and decency demand to help those who are SERIOUSLY having trouble getting through life at all.
BTW I say this as not really belonging to either group, except insofar as even the poorest Americans are living hugely better than hundreds of millions of people who happened to be born elsewhere on the globe.
___________
It is not Obama specific to me.
We started with Obama and his speech and then a few commented about stepping on constutional rights and Ann mentioned the redistrubtion of wealth and you answered and we all snowballed from there...LOL
It isn't an Obama issue because every Pres. before has still not even tackled the govt. problems at their roots.
But being that he is Pres. currently, yea we dragged him into it..LOL---but of course he is facing those battles right now in his term.
And then some say take more money from the wealthy to help fund the nation and others say do not take more money from only the wealthy.
you know, back and forth stuff!!
reinbeau
Moderator Extraordinaire
Pat, the implication in your sentence was that others think it's all about them, or you wouldn't have used the modifier 'just'. That is how it came across. As for Svengali, I'm well aware it was about mind control, but many also believe he was a mind reader - since you got my point, the 'clarification' wasn't needed.patandchickens said:
me&thegals
A Major Squash & Pumpkin Lover
There is so much to respond to, but I will limit it to this. I actually did offer this man a ride. I don't actually make a policy of offering strange men rides alone in my car, and that day I had my young daugther and niece along. I was relieved when another person in line offered him one. Not because he needed food from the pantry but because I am cautious of ALL men I don't know. I do not claim to have the willingness or means to help all people in all situations. It's a bit like a finger in the dike. I try to do what I can when I see it. I also did not say anything about offering him cash for a car. I was making the point that all these support systems are out there, but they are not always accessible.FarmerChick said:
FC, I don't know your life experiences that cause you to feel so strongly about protecting the wealth of the wealthiest. I'm sure you have reasons that are very real to you. You are right, though, that I certainly could do more to support my own belief that needy people should be helped.
Morel--I think your life experience exactly exemplifies the idea that hard-working, self-respecting people DO fall on hard times and need assistance. Maybe there were the drunk, wife-beating guys in line next to you, and the "welfare mom," but you were also there. You didn't continue to milk the system. You are now apparently doing okay. I think that has been my point all along.
Pat--Enjoy those kids! How weird about making cookies. I have butter softening on the counter right this moment to make Whoppers cookies with my kiddos! My husband and I are traveling to Virginia tomorrow to attend his 39-yo cousin's funeral. He was killed in a motorcycle accident and leaves behind 3 young kids and wife. I have thought a lot in the last few days about the preciousness of family. I have also been thinking about how this mother will hold her family together for the 12 years she will have at least 1 child at home. So, maybe that's why this topic is a bit raw for me right now.
Quail_Antwerp
Cold is on the Right, Hot is on The Left
I just ran this thread by my DH, and he said even if we tried to take more money from the rich it wouldn't help. What you'll run into is them still being rich, and not having to pay, because they'll all move to the Bahmas with their money tucked safely into Swiss Bank accounts.
eta: I think he was being tongue in cheek, but who knows. He's a quirky sense of humor. He just thinks they'll pull all of their monies out of this country and put them somewhere else.
eta: I think he was being tongue in cheek, but who knows. He's a quirky sense of humor. He just thinks they'll pull all of their monies out of this country and put them somewhere else.
patandchickens
Crazy Cat Lady
Fine, Reinbeau, I give up, I shall bow to your superior knowledge of what I mean, shall I -- also of my standards of right/wrong and what I am more or less likely to do in dire circumstances. What's the point in saying something if people can just "know" I mean something other than what those words actually say.
I am confused by "many also believe [Svengali] was a mind reader", as he was a totally fictional character in a novel, but, sure. I expect it is possible to know what an author means as opposed to writes, too. LOL
Over and out,
Pat, maybe not the first but surely not the *last* to know when something is no longer a discussion.
I am confused by "many also believe [Svengali] was a mind reader", as he was a totally fictional character in a novel, but, sure. I expect it is possible to know what an author means as opposed to writes, too. LOL
Over and out,
Pat, maybe not the first but surely not the *last* to know when something is no longer a discussion.
