Presidential Debate--who watched?

[VT-Chicklit]

I guess I am dim or something. I still dont understand why anyone would want the US government to handle their health care.

I cant get past the fact that our congress is the root cause of this whole financial debacle. They were suppose to provide oversight to Fanny Mae and Freddie Mac but instead they did nothing (almost). The one thing that was done was to take sweetheart deals on loans for themselves from those that they were overseeing. They also took alot of money from Fannie and Freddie in the form of campain contributions. In the real world, that would be consiered bribery. They did not care that the poor were being saddled with loans that they could not pay. They just wanted to line their pockets. What started out as a noble cause was destroyed because there was no common sense used. Congress has no common sense.

These same people now want to take care of the health care problem. Haven't they done enough already? They have ruined the economy and have placed in further peril the people that they said they were trying to help. The poor.

Congress could not be trusted with the Social Security money that was suppose to be in a trust fund to pay for Social Security. The broke into the Social Security lock box and stole the money and used it else where. They now want to take more of our money to take care of health care. How long do you think it will be before the money for that is spent elsewhere? There has to be a better solution.

Maybe we need to fix why health care costs so much instead of expecting the government to provide it, no matter what the cost. There are many reasons why health care costs so much. Here are a few reasons I can come up with:

1. The huge costs to train Doctors and Nurses.
2. The huge cost of starting up a practice
3. The huge cost of malpractice insurance (we are a letigous society and no doctor is perfect)
4. The huge cost in the various taxes that a practice has to pay
5. Hospitals have the same costs as Doctors only it is many times over
6. The minimal payments payed by insurance and medicare. (this is why doctors have to see more patients and the patient gets less individual care. This will only get worse under federaly funded health care)
7. The huge cost of bringing a drug from conception to the shelf. (Years of testing and trials and most never make it to the public. Those costs have to be added to the drugs that do make it.)
8. The huge cost of "bad drug" litigation. (Ther is no perfect drug. Even asprin has side effects. We need weigh the potential for problems to the need of relief from the symptom of the desease)

These are only a few reasons why health care is so expensive. If we tackle these problems and others that add cost, then maybe health care costs will be more reasonable.

One last thought, does anyone really think businesses will continue to provide health insurance if the government steps in and says they will provide it. HE DOUBLE HOCKEY STICKS no! They will dump their medical insurance as soon as they can. It costs them plenty and if they dont need it as an incentive to keep you working for them, they will dump it and keep most of the savings for themselves.

 

[ScottyG]

VT-Chicklit, I think this is a much more complex issue than we can really get into here, and I respectfully disagree with about 90% of what you've said in this post... I can't possibly address everything I'd like to.

But one thing I do want to bring up is what's conspicuously missing from your list. PROFITS. The insurance companies will do just about anything to make a profit, including charging people way too much for services so the C.E.O. can buy a private jet, and denying coverage to very sick people to save on costs.

I have a friend who had what was considered "excellent" health care coverage, and her daughter was born with a heart defect, needing multiple open-heart surgeries. Pretty soon after, she got notice from her "excellent" HMO that the surgeries were not covered because the heart condition was somehow a "pre-existing" thing, and they quickly dropped her from the HMO in the midst of the surgeries. She fought it, lost to corporate interests, and got a $100,000 bill, which led her to promptly go bankrupt and lose her home and job. (She's doing better now, but still has a lot of trouble finding jobs and houses with bankruptcy in her past.)

In any case, that is to say that while all the doctors involved were good, the insurance company executives are solely in this for the money, and will do ridiculously absurd things (a little girl born with a heart defect causes them to take away your coverage? What??) to save cash. Just one of the reasons I support the availability of a government plan, which would by definition have to pass any profits back to taxpayers.

 

[FarmerChick]

throwing out a question cause I hear this all the time....people get the big bill from the hospital and go bankrupt and lose their house????

ya know they take payments and will work out a payment schedule.

My friends Dad had no insurance, had a heart attack and needed angioplasty (?) etc...and yea he said his Dad used up most of his savings, but kept some for safety reasons, then made a million payments and is still making them.

So this situation of losing everything you own cause of a payment, I don't understand it kinda....cause many people are making reasonable payments on monster medical bills???

just wondering if anyone has info on this type of thing?

 

[annmarie]

I see what you're saying FarmerChick, but I think it would be pretty easy to go bankrupt after major medical care, even if you're the worlds greatest saver. Keep in mind that there is a huge population of single adults out there, so their income is the only income. If you're stuck in the hospital, or severely sick or injured, there's a really good chance you're going to lose your job. It's also quite likely that you'll be disabled if you've been in a terrible accident, and not be able to work. And also, a $100,000 medical bill is pretty normal these days, and for most people that's like picking up a second mortgage. It's true, that some people do a terrible job of preparing themselves for the unexpected, but still, I think that probably 90-100% of us are vulnerable to the possibilty of losing everything if the right combination of medical needs and circumstances hit us.

 

[FarmerChick]

yea I guess there are many factors involved on who can and can't make payments on medical bills. But can't you go to court and like have the payments reasonable with your income before you lose your home?

My friend at work John, his wife has (oh I forgot the name of it but very RARE) and she had to quit work and get diagnosed etc. Massive medical bills. He called a lawyer....and the lawyer said to ONLY pay the necessaries, your mortgage and light bill etc. He lost his wife's car by having it reposssed on purpose to get rid of the bill, then he cancelled all unnecessary items of course, he stopped paying on credit cards, and was hit by collections like crazy, etc. etc. Bills piled like mad but he sure never lost his home. He did go bankrupt but kept his home. As long as you pay your mortgage and property taxes they "can't" take your home.

Well---anyway---I got more off track here, basically there is tons you can do to keep your home. It is dire...definitely....when hit with monster bills into the 2-300K area, but there are ways to survive for some.

I guess it still comes down to an individual family basis!

One thing I learned from John's predictament is pay your mortgage or whatever is required to keep your home!

And he isn't the type that could downgrade more than he was...he was a double wide trailer on a small lot. He couldn't sell to go cheaper ya know. But from speaking with him I sure learned a thing or 2 on what to do when you are financially nailed to the wall.

 

[Beekissed]

FYI, for folks who can't afford medical bills...they can sometimes be "written off" as a hardship if they are that extensive. The hospital then writes this off on their taxes. Some way or another, the hospital seems to be able to get their money. If they weren't charging $6 for a Tylenol, this wouldn't be an issue in the first place.

 

[FarmerChick]

yea beekissed that is kinda what I mean. If burdened to where you can't truly survive financially, the court or someone has to step in and make payments reasonable and enforce the hardship rule.

thanks for the info! something I am filing away in my mind for "in case of"

 

[ScottyG]

Part of the issue with my friend who went bankrupt, Karen, is that she was only a year or two out of graduate school. Not a whole lot of assets to her name... enough to start a family, but still some serious student loan payments and not much savings.

 

[poppycat]

I understand ScottyG's point. Medical bills are really expensive and the insurance companies are border-line criminal. My DH and I have carried our own insurance for the past eight years because of the nature of his work. Every year they raise our premium by $1200 to $1500 and there is nothing we can do but pay up or lose the coverage.

As far as bills go, I had an appendectomy and when all the bills were totaled up it was about $20,000. And that was pretty minor. I think recently laws have been passed limiting what medical providers can do to collect on past due accounts, but that wasn't always the case.

I just don't know if the government could do a better job with health care than what we already have. Their track record with "fixing" things is a little spotty.



(last post of the morning-gotta go )

 

[Better Half]

See we already have socialized medicine, just in a roundabout, ineffective way.

If your bill is wrote off, if you file for bankruptcy, if you over pay for Tylenol, these are the methods currently used to spread around the costs. I'd rather have a system where everyone is covered up front.