This post came from a different string but fits here real well.
Beekissed said:
I don't know about y'all but this generic term SHTF doesn't really give us any clear perimeters as to how much "S" we are talking about. There are different degrees of "S" and some would be way more affected by the "S" than others....like city dwellers and such.
So.....what level of "S" are we talking about? Total system collapse? No utilities? No more fuel? No more going to work every day because there is no gas, no roads, no work place? Is everyone in the world in the same condition or is it a local "S" and only affects us temporarily? Is it a long term "S" with no easy solutions or is it a short term "S" that can be restored to previous conditions?
Inquiring minds wanna know......
Bee asks about what level of 'S', so I now want to explore the concept of "What is the 'S' made of"?
I posted this on a different string earlier. Seems as though it may be more germane to this discussion though. I have been putting a lot of thought into the concept of "just what are we talking about here when we say "TSHTF"?
Wifezilla imagines a scenario similar to what she describes as the Weimar republic. Certainly, that happened but we also know it happened once before. Are we so naive as to allow it to happen again?
One of the things I notice is that while a number of folks talk about TSHTF, they mention the S, but never seem to give any opinion or theory as to exactly the S will consist of and/or how it will affect all of us. Yes, we all have the wish to be either more SS or completely SS as much as possible. Both concepts give one the utmost in self-confidence and does wonders to minimize or actually eliminate many of the worries/anxiety most humans tend to possess.
To that end, I would like to hear exactly what folks think comprises the S and exactly how they expect to interact with the rest of the folks in not only their immediate surroundings but those of their fellow countrymen and the world for that matter.
It is hard enough to imagine that we, who profess the ss life style tend to believe that we would become "islands" in a sea of suffering and disaster and in some way compare ourselves to the story of the "Ant and the Grasshopper." In some way however, I think we all tend to realize that such isolation from others (who did NOT prepare for an emergency albeit atmospheric {and thus short} or cataclysmic {such as nuclear disaster} and thus quite long) would probably not be very successful nor would we be able to deal with the "brave new world" we will face effectively without the fear of interference from many more others than we had anticipated.
I have done quite a bit of reading on the subject and studied this for quite a long time and while the media and the "gloom/doom"sday "prophets" tend to try to make us think that a nuclear holocaust would not be survivable, the convention thinking (which makes great sense and to which I subscribe) is that it truly would be for many.
http://www.survivalring.org/FEMA196-free.pdf
The concept of TEOTWAWKI is rather vague. In order to consider the end of the world as we know it, I suppose it is important to consider the true definition of TWAWKI at least as it applies to each of us. It is a completely different thing to each of us.
If we talk about "TWAWKI" we might as well be somewhat more realistic about it and consider that many WILL survive simply because they are either prepared and in an area that is NOT decimated by the actual destructive forces themselves (such as being near ground zero) or just lucky enough not to be killed but left with nothing. What will they do? How will they respond to the cataclysm that has occurred?
It is believed that a 500 kt bomb (as opposed to the size of the one used in Hiroshima which was 15 kt) would destroy pretty much every thing for a radius of about 9 miles. That is all. Yes, I realize that the density of the population in such an area makes that a horrific thought but the fact is, even a nuclear weapon is limited as to how much destruction it can cause. The farther away from such a devastating event obviously then increases the chances of survival for many, radioactive fallout, radiation poisoning, etc. not withstanding.
What then? Do we imagine the "Government" will come and solve our problems? (does anyone think they will survive it, too? Hellooo, Hurricaine Katrina anyone?)
So, then my question remains, what do we(the SS) aspirants THINK will really happen and how do we expect to interact with what we imagine will be the changes caused by TEOTWAWKI.
Will we attempt to involute and hide from others who didn't prepare? Will we band together and attempt to protect each other from those who didn't prepare or those who just seize the opportunity to take it from those who did prepare? Will we be able to start society back up again so that life continues, albeit somewhat different than it had been up to the "singularity" that we predict?
So, I guess to summarize my question, "What do you think the S is made of?"
Enquiring minds want to know...mine is among them.
Best to all
Trim sends
Remember your food is considered "gourmet" so price it accordingly! Oh, and a bill for cleaning service, too, and grounds maintainence.
Honestly though,..if you always have lived like the S'sHTF,..well you never notice too much when it does.
Frankly, I don't think there is much worth moving back here to. Your assets now are land in a reasonable growing climate (warm summers, not as drought-prone as we in the West), and I would imagine a better community. If things got really bad, I wouldn't want to be in the Seattle area, for sure. 
One of the DUMBEST people I've ever met was the farmer who rented me a turnout with shelter for my horses for 14 years. HIS father had numerous old chicken buildings and an egg business that supplied the twin cities (Champaign-Urbana, IL, population ~ 100K then) with most of their eggs. This son took over, built aginormous Morton Building, so big you can see it on a satellite, and within a year ran his father's business INTO THE GROUND!! BUT, he, unlike his father, had a 4 year AG degree. I have enough hours for almost a PhD, (232) but with only a Bachelor's and teacher certification, of which IL forced me take 100 additional hours to complete. The expression, "Those who can't, teach" is wholly applicable to a great many Professors at our many Universities. They are spoon feeding garbage to our youth. Their methods of practice in businesses only work when times are really good, which they are not. Any businesses which survive will be results oriented, of which YOU are expert, MsPony. 
. I love it when the power goes out. I find it humorous that everyone seems lost, not knowing what to do cause they have no electricity. Even the gas stations, who could run gas operated generators shut down.............the incompetence baffles me.
