Stocking Up, Putting Back, Prepping = Paranoia?

[Leta]

I don't think I could ever live with killing someone who is simply unprepared and trying to feed his family, but hell if I will allow my family to starve because others are unprepared. My first choice would be inviting my neighbors to help work the land in exchange for food, but in the meantime I pray that I am never put in that situation.

This.

 

[old fashioned]

If, if, if & I repeat...IF it ever got bad enough that we were in a famine situation & no food available to the rest of the nation.....their motivation for survival could become violent. I too would hate to be the only thing between an angry hungry mob trying to feed their families & what little food & supplies I have stored for my own family. The depth of the human survival instinct can get mighty ugly really quick when people are denied basic neccessities.
Many years ago I worked in a welfare office (for 12 years) and it wasn't easy to tell someone with families that had been laid off work, loosing everything they had owned, run out of savings & any other means of support that because of some minor technicality...they were not entitled to any benefits. Contrary to popular belief, there were many families like this (even during the so called 'good' years of 80's & 90's) that had been hardworking, self supporting & for whatever reasons had fallen on hard times. They weren't trying to screw the system or take advantage of it...just trying to get by until they could find another decent job...what the program was meant for. Trust me.....it wasn't pretty :/

 

[Leta]

That is heartbreaking. I see people all the time who "game" the system, it's just not called welfare, so the fact that people who really need the help can't get it just frustrates and infuriates me.

Like my cousin's mom... she was left money by her dad, and bought a small house with cash. My uncle bought her a car a million years ago, but since she doesn't work, she barely drives and thus still has the same car. She gets SSI for my cousin, and gets caregiver wages for herself from the state. So she's living on like $17K per year, but if you have a paid off house and full allotment of food stamps, and no commuting expenses, you don't pay for much. Utilities, insurance, taxes, clothes, toilet paper. She has more than enough to pay for that stuff.

But she is keeping my cousin (he's an adult, but disabled) from his father, because he'd rather live with his father, and my cousin's mom won't just lose her son if he moves in with his dad, but her meal ticket as well. It isn't called welfare, but she fits the definition of welfare queen pretty neatly.

I am not trying to talk smack, honestly. We got public assistance when I was pregnant with our daughter, like $400 per month in food stamps, plus heating assistance and WIC. It was a godsend, and I am very grateful for it. It allowed us to start our pantry, as a matter of fact, and we have adhered to the pantry principle ever since. The first things we did when DH got his current job 4.5 years ago was to buy a freezer and gamma seal lids, and buy a wood pellet stove and insulate our house. Those hard times left an impression and honestly made us better people for it. But it was never our plan to stay on assistance as long as we could and fight to keep those benefits. It was those hard times that made us realize how terrifying it is to be so dependent on a job, and pushed us hard toward self sufficiency- so that even if TSHTF, we can survive. It was so scary- the third month that we had food stamps, we had started building a pantry, but it wasn't very full yet, because as we all know it takes time. That month there was a snafu and we didn't get money reloaded onto our food card. We had stockpiled baking supplies- dry buttermilk, dry nonfat milk, AP flour, WW flour, soy flour, gluten, white sugar, brown sugar, molasses, vanilla and some other extracts, honey, yeast-, 25# of brown rice, 10# of dry beans, spices, and some (not enough) frozen and canned fruits and veggies. No frozen meat or canned tuna or salmon. We ate beans and rice (with WIC cheese!) and pancakes (we spent $2 on 2# of margarine and made it last all month) and WIC eggs literally all month long. That's what we had. My husband didn't eat a scrap of meat all month, and we had no fresh fruit or vegetables. When the fourth month rolled along, and we had food stamps again, we bought $80 worth of produce the first day and gorged ourselves on fresh fruit and salad.

But man, we were so happy and relieved that we had food. If we hadn't put that stuff by, we would have literally been reduced to begging. So I don't think that to stockpile, you have to be worried about the zombie apocalypse. Mostly I just worry about gaps in our income.

 

[Wannabefree]

Leta I know what you mean...we've been practically living off bologna for several weeks trying hard not to kill the egg machines out there for a little something different The same stuff gets old FAST. Thankfully we have had the garden, but DH is a meat eater and we have had very little. Does bologna really qualify as meat in the first place? Actually we got in this mess trying to stay OFF assistance. We lost We're (temporarily) back on because I have been selling chickens to make the house payment and knocked out our meat supply. Sticky situation around here sometimes, "dunno whether to crap or go blind," as DH says. Our problem at the moment is these stupid BILLS that require CASH. UGH, I wish DH could find steady work again. Having said THAT I think one of the best ways to be SS is to pay off EVERYTHING and we WERE working on it until TCrapHTF in the employment department for us PAY OFF EVERYTHING you can folks. Debt is a trap. We own everything but the home outright, and it is a ball and chain at the moment. A necessary ball and chain, but a friggin ball and chain nonetheless. I'm stocking up on beef when we get money on our card. We have veggies running out our ears and I hate tomatoes and okra right now

And I am laughing a bit at "gaming" the system. I turn in everything, even things I don't *technically* have to turn in.. as in untraceable income would be easily hidden. I just can't lie Fortunately/unfortunately we're still poor enough to qualify right now :/

The pantry has come in handy for survival, but I have been eyeballing the squirrels and our poultry for weeks now.

 

[Farmfresh]

Nothing like a nice squirrel stew!

I think you are exactly right Leta. Who needs a zombie apocalypse? We can starve to death right now just by not having a job!

Those little "gaps" in income these days can put a world of hurt on. I am very thankful right now that I was able to get a roasting hen out of the freezer stores today and combine it with tomatoes and cucumbers from our garden. We will be eating a very nice meal from those pantry stores when if left to my checkbook we would be going hungry today.

 

[Leta]

Yeah, that's my biggest fear- we'll get our little place in the country, get all set up the way we want, have no debt but the mortgage... and then lose our income.

I haven't figured out a way to do completely debt free, though. I'm working on it.

 

[savingdogs]

Hang in there, Farm, I know you can do it! I know how hard it is waiting the long wait for SSI.

 

[Wannabefree]

Yeah, that's my biggest fear- we'll get our little place in the country, get all set up the way we want, have no debt but the mortgage... and then lose our income.

I haven't figured out a way to do completely debt free, though. I'm working on it.

I'm a big fan of Dave Ramsey, pre economic craphole, he's all sunshine and annoying at the moment, so I haven't been listening as often. We were working the "Total Money Makeover" while DH was working, but we never saw the tsunami coming. In the beginning of this mess we went through all of our emergency fund in a matter of 9 months. We've been barely floating for a couple years now, with not enough income to try to pay anything down rapidly, and not many options for extra income. The extras we have found, we're working on or we wouldn't have made it this long.

My advice...don't get your little place in the country until you have saved a HUGE down payment and can get a manageable mortgage that is less than 25% of the worst case scenario take home pay. Just because they'll LET ya, doesn't mean you HAVE to buy all that much house and land..you want to create a cushion for yourself just in case of harder times ahead. Our mortgage used to be only 15% of our take home pay, and with the current circumstances it jumped to just a hair over 41% of our take home pay. We were paying double mortgage payments for a while, and now our credit sucks so bad we couldn't refi if we wanted to Take home dropped like a rock here. Prepare for the worst and hope for the best. Meanwhile move verrrrry slowly and deliberately toward your goal and constantly keep a check on your footing

ETA: I just had to add that IF we had had car payments during any of the past 2 years....we would have been SOOOOOOOOOO sunk a long time ago, and that is my point of being debt free, or in our case, debt free except for the house. We just need to get the income back up, but otherwise we would have lost everything, literally years ago.

 

[Farmfresh]

I have Hubby the Practical aka Hubby the Cautious. That is why I have no acreage yet. I must be completely debt free and have enough CASH to pay for the property saved up (or darned close to it). He wants to live as mortgage free as possible.

 

[SKR8PN]

There is a difference between being prepared, and paranoia. What I never understood was the compulsion to buy all the guns and ammo you could get. You do realize, that if you really have to defend yourself with all your guns, along with any hunting you might be doing, that your ammo WILL run out? Sure, it might take a while, but eventually it will. And if SREALLYHTF, fat chance you'll be able to get any more. Guns are the obvious and not very wise answer. If you really want to defend yourself, you'll have to get crafty and sustainable. (Which is why I'm vaguely annoyed with the government down here not allowing bow hunting.)

Anyway. I'm going to have a large garden growing this year (er, well, "large" doesn't really apply, but big enough for us, I hope), and hopefully, I can coerce and arm twist some of the neighbors into thinking chickens are a good idea. If I can convince the old people around us that gardening is the way to go, then we'd all be better off, and I'll have "neutralized" potential zombies if S really did HTF.

2000 rounds of .308(7.62 military round)
6000 rounds of .223 (military round as well)
4000 rounds of .40 caliber(military round as well as police)
10 cases of 12 gauge
8 cases of 20 gauge
4 cases of .410 gauge
I am guessing well over 20 bricks of .22 caliber
LOTS of muzzle loader stuff.
Lots and lots of compound bow stuff.
Lots and lots of crossbow stuff.
Not to mention the .44 magnum revolver and ammo or the reloading stuff I have.
It's gonna be a LOOONG time before I run out.

I see nothing wrong with being well armed & having your stockpile include weapons & ammo to defend yourself & family, life & liberty. Yes, it's also good to know & befriend your neighbors in a group effort of defense. Some people in society refuse to be reasonable and as a last resort may need further prompting.

On another note....if I remember correctly...I can't remember Skr8pn ever mentioning stockpiling anything other than guns & ammo so is he trying to say he's going to be one of those zombies the rest of us have to watch out for????

AND currently in the news is a shoot out with 8 people dead in rural Ohio. I'm hoping & Skr8pn & his neighbor lady weren't involved.

That wasn't me Old Fashioned!! And yes, we ARE stockpiling more than just ammo and firearms.