What is a Zombie?

[Up-the-Creek]

For the most part I do not think none of us knows for sure what we would do in any dire situation. If it come to kill or be killed,..well you have to do what you have to do. If in any situation where the SHTF I do not think any of us would survive long alone,..family or not. If you look at any ancient civilization, they lived in groups or tribes. They had to so they could survive and be able to protect themselves. If you tried to go at it alone, someone will come along that will take you down. Skills is the most important thing to have I think,..plus if you are die hard convinced that this kind of situation will be seen in your lifetime,..well you better get out of the cities and the suburbs.A packed pantry will do you no good. That is the wrong place to be.

 

[Lady Henevere]

...well you better get out of the cities and the suburbs.A packed pantry will do you no good. That is the wrong place to be.

I don't know...I have found that the suburbs where I live and in the nearby area where I grew up promote a pretty strong sense of community. We're neighbors; we share property lines and interests; our kids have grown up and been educated together; we socialize together; we share food from our gardens and spend some holidays together; we rejoice in each others' successes and mourn each others' sorrows. We literally live together, and many of us have for more than a decade. I don't fear my neighbors if a crisis comes. I would easily go to them for help, and they would just as easily come to me. And if an outsider were to threaten our homes and families, I have no doubt that we would protect each other. I'm guessing that many other suburbs and urban areas are the same way, though I can only speak from my own experience of course.

I came across an article a while back that discussed urban versus rural in a crisis situation. Not a biblical apocalypse (in which case anything goes), but just really hard times. Here are some excerpts (which I have edited); the first part is from the author's time spent living in a rural area:

....I started to wonder whether, if a disaster came, I was really in the right place. We had the best garden for miles around, and everyone knew it. If law broke down, wasn't there more than a chance that my next door neighbor, a gun-selling meth dealer and felon, might just shoot me for all that food? How about the anti-environmentalists past him, who shot Stellar's jays for fun and clearcut their land when they suspected spotted owls lived there? Or the two feuding families beyond them: One had fired a pistol during an argument, and neither would give way when their cars met on the road. I began to sense the outlines of a pattern that replicated one in society at large. We have the technical means to feed, clothe, and house all humanity. But legions starve because we have not learned to tolerate and support one another. People's real problems are not technical, they are social and political.

***
Over the last two decades, millions of people have moved out of cities. Many of them are people of modest means, driven out by the high costs of urban life. Unfortunately, they have brought their city ways with them. Our neighbors in the country all clearcut their land and planted acres of grass. Many built enormous houses, since low interest rates made more square footage affordable.... Unlike earlier self-reliant country folk, these are simply city people with really big yards. And there are millions of them.

Sociologists Jane Jacobs and Lewis Mumford have each noted that during the Depression and other hard times, urban residents have generally fared better than ruralites. The causes mainly boil down to market forces and simple physics. Since most of the population lives in or near cities, when goods are scarce the greater demand, density, and economic power in the cities directs resources to them. Shipping hubs are mostly in cities, so trucks are emptied before they get out of town.

In the Depression, farmers initially had the advantage of being able to feed themselves. But they soon ran out of other supplies: coal to run forges to fix machinery, fertilizer, medicine, clothing, and almost every other non-food item. Without those, they couldn't grow food. Farmers who could still do business with cities survived. Those too remote or obstinate blew away with the Kansas dust.
***
The main lack of cities compared to farms is food-growing, but farms lack nearly everything elseand most of that comes from cities. Setting aside for the moment the all-important issue of social and political cohesion, for cities to survive a disaster, the critical necessity is for them to learn to grow food. For country people to survive, inhabitants will need to provide nearly every single other essential good for themselves. And since many country people are simply transplanted urbanites lacking gardening or other land skills, but having the isolation that makes social cohesion unnecessary to learn (for now), their survival is even more doubtful. If catastrophe comes, the cities may be unpleasant, but I fear the countryside may be far worse off.

Thoughts?

 

[Up-the-Creek]

I live in a rural area and we also have a since of community here too. We are not farmers, just people with lots of land and wildlife. We have no meth cookers, or gun packing menaces, just normal ordinary families and one guy who thinks the FBI is after him and he is an astronaut that is qualified to do brain surgery,...he is harmless. Everyone here knows people for miles around, I mean miles. I don't see this as what that describes. These are people I grew up with, knew their grandparents, our great-grandparents where friends. Not all suburbs is what you are describing,..you are lucky to have that. Most people don't know their neighbors in more populated areas. That is where I wouldn't want to be. Just saying.

 

[k0xxx]

Thoughts?

As long as the grid stays up, there is fuel to get food from the farms to the cities and for heating, and more importantly social order doesn't break down, the cities and surround suburbs will be livable. Also, in a temporary disaster, the cities will receive help long before the rural areas. It only makes sense to put the resources where the most people are. But, if any one of the above happens, I doubt that you would want to be there. Especially if the grid is down for an extended time, because that means no food, no water, no sanitation, and no fuel. Not a pretty picture for city life.

All of my neighbors within a mile of me have wells, springs, ponds, gardens, chickens and/or other livestock, wood for heating/cooking, wildlife, and are used to extended periods of the grid being down (well, at least for a periods of weeks, as has happened twice in the last few years). If a loss of the grid would occur, in which situation would you rather be?

 

[Up-the-Creek]

Good points k0xxx. On our property we have 4 springs, a creek, and 3 miles down the road, a river. You know a real river, not one of those you can jump over. I always find it funny when we are out and I see this creek and it says on the sign,.."such and such river". Of course I know a river is measured by its length not width, but still,..its funny. Anyway,..we have a pond also stocked with fish. Outdoor toilets everywhere (the woods),..and wildlife. Plants and animals. If the power would go down, we would be okay too, we have had practice many times. Our heat,..we make sure needs no power,wood heat or propane,...that would be a catastrophe for the grid to go down in the winter. Heck with starving,..people would freeze! We make sure ammo boxes are full plus some,..never know when you will have to kill dinner. I think the rural area would be better for most. As long as you arent an "outsider".

 

[Beekissed]

Unlike earlier self-reliant country folk, these are simply city people with really big yards. And there are millions of them.

I agree with this...in spades. These urbanites didn't come to integrate into the rural community...they came to take advantage of cheap land, low crime, low taxes and the bucolic landscapes.

They neither had a desire to learn the lifestyles nor the intention of changing their city ways. Much like the much bemoaned illegal Mexican immigrants that folks complain of today....only these folks speak English....sorta.

They seem to hold their rural neighbors in contempt, ridicule their homely lifestyles and would be the first to take what they have. After all, these country bumpkins have plenty, they can grow more.

I hear it every day.....How can you expect us to find the time to learn those skills..us with our busy lives and our work/play schedules?

Besides...we have a grocery store, cell phones, cars...we don't need a garden and such.

Oh...and my favorite? Well...I'd just come over to your house if things got that bad! Said with a laugh.

Really?

And a direct quote: "I would rather DIE than have to kill my own food!"

My rejoinder to that? Be careful what you say....you may have to eat those words for lack of anything else to consume.

 

[Wifezilla]

You know a real river, not one of those you can jump over. I always find it funny when we are out and I see this creek and it says on the sign,.."such and such river". Of course I know a river is measured by its length not width, but still,..its funny.

You would die laughing over what the call a lake here in Colorado

"I would rather DIE than have to kill my own food!"

Uhhh...Ok. Nice knowing you!

 

[Old Sew'n'Sew]

Personally, I don't see this type of scenario happening (but I do admit is could, as it has happened in the past so it probably will again). I can easily see a sort of an extended 1930's depression, that goes on for quite a long time though. Especially since we have dug such a large hole of debt, and we have no manufacturing base left.

So we are thinking in terms of being prepared for whatever, if it be Great Depression part ll, or apocalypse.

We already have a frame of reference for the Gr. Depression because there are still some alive that can tell us or we can read recorded history.

That generation did survive and rebuild the economy but I don't think they had to shoot zombies to do it, they became stronger for their experiences.

Now the Merriam Webster Dictionary says: apocalypse: a writing prophesying a cataclysm in which evil forces are destroyed- See Bible-

So.... if "the" Apocalypse were to happen, and one would be one of the survivors I guess there would be no need for weapons of self defense, because evil will have been destroyed, and our troubles would be over, which is the real purpose for destroying evil.

I'm just trying to help you all see the glass as half full.

There there are things happening now that makes it look like impending doom, but there are other ways it could turn out, and in that case, we can have the biggest party on the planet with the supplies that have been stored!!! Also those weapons could be melted down for farming implements!!!

I saw Jericho and I liked that series on T.V. and it was very accurate portrayal IMO, but I have never seen a portrayal of a peaceful world where everybody has love for their nieghbor and they make the earth the perfect place to live, for people and animals. The reason is because nobody would watch it because not enough drama and not enough explosions.

Survival skills are fine and I know you will do this to me when I say, cultivate in yourself more love for people than they have for you, and that would be the prime trait to have in order to survive.

 

[Boyd]

Personally, I don't see this type of scenario happening (but I do admit is could, as it has happened in the past so it probably will again). I can easily see a sort of an extended 1930's depression, that goes on for quite a long time though. Especially since we have dug such a large hole of debt, and we have no manufacturing base left.

So we are thinking in terms of being prepared for whatever, if it be Great Depression part ll, or apocalypse.

We already have a frame of reference for the Gr. Depression because there are still some alive that can tell us or we can read recorded history.

That generation did survive and rebuild the economy but I don't think they had to shoot zombies to do it, they became stronger for their experiences.

Now the Merriam Webster Dictionary says: apocalypse: a writing prophesying a cataclysm in which evil forces are destroyed- See Bible-

So.... if "the" Apocalypse were to happen, and one would be one of the survivors I guess there would be no need for weapons of self defense, because evil will have been destroyed, and our troubles would be over, which is the real purpose for destroying evil.

I'm just trying to help you all see the glass as half full.

There there are things happening now that makes it look like impending doom, but there are other ways it could turn out, and in that case, we can have the biggest party on the planet with the supplies that have been stored!!! Also those weapons could be melted down for farming implements!!!

I saw Jericho and I liked that series on T.V. and it was very accurate portrayal IMO, but I have never seen a portrayal of a peaceful world where everybody has love for their nieghbor and they make the earth the perfect place to live, for people and animals. The reason is because nobody would watch it because not enough drama and not enough explosions.

Survival skills are fine and I know you will do this to me when I say, cultivate in yourself more love for people than they have for you, and that would be the prime trait to have in order to survive.

I'd be the first one to do so Well, except for my hunting rifle. I grew up on venison, and until its common to farm deer meat, I suppose I'll always have to hunt for them.

 

[justusnak]

Bee, I get that response from people I know..." If it gets really bad, I will just come to your place" I usually reply with..." and I will meet you at the door with my gun, If you come empty handed, you will leave, or I will shoot" Boy the looks I get! I was having this discussion with a woman I know...not really a friend, but an acquaintance...I told her I would NOT let her in. She was shocked, and said...well, some friend. That's when I explained...if I let YOU in, you would bring your spouse, kids, their spouses, their kids...etc. We would ALL starve..so, don't come running MY way...prepare yourselves.
I think rural people would fare well...if they are well prepared...food, water, clothing, tools, weapons.