Energy efficiency versus renewable/green energy?

[DianeB]

As I was listening to the fan of the computer in this class I was subbing, I started to think about energy saving. Wouldn't it be better for people to turn off their compiters and lights for school districts to save money instead of laying off teachers?

Of course, I started to think about energy efficiency in general. Personally, I think it would be better to invest in energy effiecency technology and programs - such as carpooling. It would be inplemented almost immediately at little to no cost. There has to be quite a bit of energy savings in say better bus systems or LED lights.

Is energy efficiency the way to go? Should we invest more money in programs and technology that saves energy not just create it?

 

[FarmerChick]

It is give and take as with anything in this world.

While carpooling is wonderful if you work in an area that has a concentrated amt. of people going to the same workplace---for me out in rural areas....all us workers came from opposite ends of the county to work our jobs. A carpool would take up more gas to complete.

A better bus system might be more important. To be able to get people from "further out" into areas without not using the system cause it doesn't suit their routes etc. Also better bus engine technology would be nice along with auto technology.

I saw a show that was wonderful. How to save energy. It had the basics. All companies if they only turned off their computer monitors at night would save the world from having to possibly build another energy plant in the future. All street lights should go to LED. The savings in energy and city usage was extreme. All lightbulbs should be CFL or LED and the savings was monsterous to the whole of the earth.

I think slowly people are changing over and hitting the power button off more and using less power where they can. But no one will ever get the world to do it overnight. People on a whole are slow to change when direct catatastrophe is not in their faces.

 

[DianeB]

Like your new icon FarmerChick.

Personally, it is easier for me to put my computer and entertainment system on a powerstrip, change lights to CFLs, bike or walk instead of driving (live in a city), combine trips when using a car, use a crockpot instead of oven, etc. Instead of, putting in solar panels or campaiging my electric company to pursue green energy. Though I would love solar panels.

Quite a bit of people still don't use this line of reasoning - always running around and turning lights off for others :/ I do think that many are becoming more aware of energy conservation. Especially when they see their gas/electric bills rise. There were commercials on CA TV about flicking the switch. (Most have forgotten about our energy and water crisis with this budget mess.) Even Oprah did a few programs on it. (Yes, she does have that much influence.)

It may seem like I am pointing finger - probably am. Penny pinchers and part time treehuggers are use to looking at the bottom line. All the little things do add up to quite a bit of money and energy.

In response to your post, I do agree that we need to aggressively pursue both. It seems to me that more people are focused on making more energy than saving it. Perhaps if they posted more studies the benefits of energy concervation. Didn't the gov't really push for concervation in the late 70s? Didn't it work? On some documentary they stated that the fuel efficiency standards and conservation techniques saved about 2 billion gallons of oil a day or about 20% of gasoline use. I wonder how this cash for clunkers program will work out. Will more people driving fuel efficient cars save gas?

Edited for wordiness

 

[FarmerChick]

again it is a tough call on what small effects truly help

for me, I conserve. For money reasons and to help the earth, but again, I will not give up or do without.

while others just live their lives saying do it all, use it all, and never does the future come into play.

so it is a catch 22 big time. unless the catastrophe is in your face, change will be slow.

I believe the planet is doomed. when "the day" happens whenever, big change will be forced to happen overnight. those people will have to deal with it. but until then, small changes help balance those that will not change. what more can we truly do....nothing that I can see but elect people who believe that true change is needed--and right now, not later--as as much as we hate forced change, it must happen.

just a hard call on all sides but the "big picture" is seen by so few.

 

[FarmerChick]

oh and for all the gas we in this country save----the "up and coming" countries that didn't have---want. and yes they will use on their new cars what we save.

hmm...I don't know the true scope of all of it. I just hope in general most will not "want"--yet again, you can't deny people "want".

 

[DianeB]

again it is a tough call on what small effects truly help

for me, I conserve. For money reasons and to help the earth, but again, I will not give up or do without.

while others just live their lives saying do it all, use it all, and never does the future come into play.

so it is a catch 22 big time. unless the catastrophe is in your face, change will be slow.

I believe the planet is doomed. when "the day" happens whenever, big change will be forced to happen overnight. those people will have to deal with it. but until then, small changes help balance those that will not change. what more can we truly do....nothing that I can see but elect people who believe that true change is needed--and right now, not later--as as much as we hate forced change, it must happen.

just a hard call on all sides but the "big picture" is seen by so few.

True, we are probably the exception. That's why education is so important. If more studies and articles were posted about how much conservation saves, more people would start to think in that direction. Heck, if the media took conservation more seriously it would go a long way.

But I do think you can save quite a bit of energy without sacrificing quality of life. Insulation, energy efficient appliances and fuel efficient vehicles are not going to cut into anyone's happiness. Most things were developed and built when energy was thought limitless. There has to be quite a bit of room for improvement.

As for schools, energy savings could be 3-5% of their budget. Not a lot if looked at by itself. However, their budget shortfall was around 10 -15% this year. 5% savings could have cut the amount of layoffs as much as one-third to a half. That does makes a big difference in this economy.

 

[FarmerChick]

problem to me is you have "use this insulation, that is 30% more cost to build that school in Africa" and save energy and money in the long run.
But they don't have the 30% more to pay those costs. What do they use, the worst insulation to cut costs for their greater good?

BUT of course if the cheaper and less energy version is not available, and they must use newer technology which costs more, does the school ever get built? Does the old go off the market for better production and energy savings? yet it is unaffordable?

I hope you understand the way I wrote that..LOL


While we must move forward it will never be fast.
I think it is too late already. The "save the usage" we do now will buy time. It won't buy forever.

Then again, there is no forever in the solar system. The big picture is it all comes to an ending...whether we do it faster, or the cosmos does it whenever.

For those who have---can not say---been there, done that, had a wonderful life full of convenience, but do not do that--it is wrong, yet we won't give it up to the fullest extent. How can others see it as "trying and true" when so many don't give it up?

Others say look at France, USA, Canada, Italy, Switzxerland, and the many other countries, they have. why don't we have. We want. And they will get. And when they do, do they care if "we know better"?

So I guess it is up to the big global countries to start the revolution in products available to be more friendly. But to me again, it is too late.
So hey, live good, live as simple as we are willing to do and enjoy life--(the only one we get I think

This generation won't fix anything...they can only help the future to progress. At least I think of it that way.

 

[DianeB]

I am not talking so much insulation or skylights. They are great but the upfront cost is prohibitive to most school districts.

I was thinking more on the lines of making sure everyone turns off lights. Most teachers leave their lights on when out to lunch and after they leave for the day. Putting computers and ELMO on power strips and actually use those powerstrips. Give teachers a good external hard drive that they can plug into their much more energy efficient laptops. All teachers bring their laptops to school but don't want to put school software on them. Also, let them stream internet on their laptops to use with the ELMO or check intraschool e-mails. This way they can get rid of those huge, energy sucking desktops that are on all the time, some 24/7.

Here is this PDF from some school district about energy savings.
www.apsenergyconservation.org/PDF/EnergyFactsforTeachers.pdf According to this 25-30% of energy is wasted. This district could save $220,000 a year if all the teachers just turned off their lights during lunch. That is about 3% of their energy cost.

As for want. Most people do want more livable/walkable cities, fuel efficient vehicles and homes built with good insulation. Is that what you meant by want? Sorry, I am having a hardtime understanding what you mean by want, the cosmos and so on.

 

[FarmerChick]

I scoped in the global wants and needs.



Are we talking a simple usage of "all teachers learn to be more energy efficient in the US"

well of course you can spend money to make teachers have power strips and turn things off. you can have meetings to tell all teachers to turn off the lights and be more efficient. yes you can tell teachers to convey energy savings in their classroom and simple notions as turn off the lights when leaving a room. yes you can cut down power in the classroom by showing only 1 video movie to learn history and not 2 per day. there are tons of ways to cut energy costs in ANY situation.


can you "make" anyone turn off a light?, nope
can you take power sucking computers away from the classroom and implement better usage technology, sure!!

of course knowledge is power to turn off a light means saving energy obviously, but can you make that happen without the "light police" checking every classroom? can you make any person save wattage? nope







so in general, yes all should know to save energy in well educated countries. we care maybe. simple in a small way, turn off a light, do this or that and save. can it be done on an ordered scale, nope.


for every teacher you ask to save a watt of power in the US......150 countries are sucking up that power overseas.

what is the point unless we think global use and global correction and global ideas for better technology.




yes keep it simple. we all must do our part. but what about the BILLIONS of others that don't turn off a light or have a power strip?


I took it too far into global....LOL....if it is your school district you want to save power and money...yes very simple to make that happen in my thoughts. Train all people to care about the usage and environment in your local area.

 

[DianeB]

I was using teachers as an example. There are many others that waste energy.

As for other countries, it is the developed and the quickly developing countries that use the most energy. US is about 5% of the world pop. and uses 25% of the world's energy. It is the per capita usage that is important. That is why the focus should be on them, first. They have the means to bring down their energy usage. Second, we should focus lesser developed countries. We need to help them develop in a way that is not as polluting.

I use to live in Ghana and can tell you this country is not even close to using up all the world's energy. Over half the population doesn't even have electricity, running water or cars. Pretty much everyone else in the world lives like this. As for a school in Africa, most - unless in an urban area - don't even have electricity or enough chalk to write on the chalkboard. In essence, most places do not have the luxury to have resources to reduce.

You can make an exception for Asia. China is a rapidly developing nation that is now the biggest contributor to CO2 emmision. Just behind the US. Per capita it is still way behind us and other developed countries but this is still a problem. They need to turn things around before it becomes a really big problem. Most policies are for making China like the US. You can't even bike in any major cities. Having over a billion people in cars spells trouble.