How many have actually made the change?

[GhostRider65]

WOW Great Thread
Seems Tim and others have been reading my mind, I have been preparing for years for the WTSHTF situation and I fear it's coming much much too soon, we do live in the country I bought this place in 99. wanted animals and out of the city. We couldn't find a nice place with enough land so settled on a nice place and rented land for our animals. But what drove me was putting up with ornery neighbors, sirens screaming all night long, nasty rotten welfare children rampaging through the neighborhood whilst mommy and daddy attend the bar scene and all night parties..... can't see the sun set because the neighbors house is in the way like on top of each other I felt smothered...... OMG I just wanted to run away to the moon, and that didn't seem far enough away to me at the time.
I finally woke up to aa more natural lifestyle when I became disabled on my job and could no longer work those 70 to 80 hours a week at my 2 jobs, my x is an x because he's a drunk and after I couldn't work all them hours I found I couldn't survive on his little check because the bars were getting it all. So I did get divorced after 17 years.
But God was watching out for me, because I found a wonderful man with like interests and like handiness, and love of animals, and we have been striving for the day we move farther into the middle of nowhere, where even the tax man can't find us....... that's where I wish to be, my entire family has thought me nutts for years for my lifestyle, I can I have chickens, dogs, horses, plan on goats and sheep too but a bit in the future yet need more land. plus my siblings are the I only care about me type and I just couldn't deal with them any longer so basically I disowned them, I haven't spoken to them since Dads funeral in Nov. 09. Partly because of my parents and partly because they just make me sick with there selfishness. I took care of my mom and dad from 05 to 09, mom passed in 07, and my wonderful siblings never did anything to help out but wanted to run the show at the end, and spend every nickel mom and dad ever had and then some, on useless overpriced funerals and fancy caskets ect........ sent me over the edge.
Anyway sorry if that sounded like a rant it sorta was, every time I get started with that issue it irritates the crap out a me. Now back to our plans, we have a property picked out large enough to sustain us approximately. 42 acres, in thee exact middle of nowhere, no electric, hookups for over 2 miles, have to get an easement just to get to the land surrounded by national forest and 1 private owner. The perfect place to be when TSHTF, cheap too them 40 acres is only 28,0000.00 now the problem being how do I sell my current place with this rotten economy.......also where to start on starting over the way we want, I designed an underground house and barn for the critters so they are protected as well, plus I want it to be virtually invisible to the wandering idiots who will surely come looking to steal anything you have once the economy falls apart and they are no longer getting all those entitlements and free stuff. So we have a long road ahead of us, this years taxes will buy our backhoe, so all we have to do is move and start building. The first year will be spent in a trailer type thing while our posts cure... but I don't care can't be any worse than a camping trip with animals....so I'm praying we can get out a here this year before late fall......I'm also praying the fall of our government holds off just a bit longer because I ain't ready just yet....

 

[Wannabefree]

I've made about all the changes I plan on making for a bit. I want to pay off my house before my first gray hair arrives unwelcomed I do have a couple projects still planned, but nothing big. I have an extensive network of people with like minds nearby, a lot are family, some are good friends. We need more land, btu can live off what we have until the house is paid. The fall of our gooberment is going to be quick in reality, but slow in the media. They still aren't picking up on much of anything till 6-12 months later That should buy me some time to finish what I have started God willing, we'll get there. I live in the country already, sooooo...not a whole lot needed changing

 

[Icu4dzs]

The QUESTION then becomes, how many folks have actually "taken the plunge since 2008"? I have read a lot of posts where folks say they are "hoping to get some land next year" or words to that effect, but the issue of getting a piece of land is paled in comparison to "what do you do with it once you have it?" The cost of EVERYTHING you need to convert a piece of bare land to a working homestead, particularly in this current economic situation is staggering. Yes, some folks do know how to scavenge and make things out of stuff they get free or really cheap, but the question still is do we really know/understand what it takes to convert a piece of bare land to a functioning homestead? How do you get water, food, shelter, and the things attendant to them there when changing from a "city life" to a subsistence style of living somewhere remote from the usual location of "civilization"?

So, I ask you all, how many of you have made this fundamental change in the way you think, and live so that any major change in society will have minimal impact on your ability to live, and support your family?

I believe the two portions of Trim's long post that I've isolated, above, contain his basic question, Beekissed. (Of course, we should let him speak for himself.)

But it was a pretty long post... interesting for sure... easy to get lost in it.

OK, so here I am "speaking for myself, and this one will be brief.
It appears that joel_bc was able to summarize some of the questions I asked, but on re-reading my post (a bit of free thinking in a way) it appears that I asked a lot of questions, and many very interesting answers have been generated by them. So rather than re-invent the wheel by identifying all my questions, I will simply leave it alone and see what folks are motivated to share win us here. You all are great and to be honest, everyone appears to share some common thoughts.
Don't quit. The more we say,the more we learn about each other and more importantly, about OURSELVES!
Trim sends
//BT//

 

[Beekissed]

The QUESTION then becomes, how many folks have actually "taken the plunge since 2008"? I have read a lot of posts where folks say they are "hoping to get some land next year" or words to that effect, but the issue of getting a piece of land is paled in comparison to "what do you do with it once you have it?" The cost of EVERYTHING you need to convert a piece of bare land to a working homestead, particularly in this current economic situation is staggering. Yes, some folks do know how to scavenge and make things out of stuff they get free or really cheap, but the question still is do we really know/understand what it takes to convert a piece of bare land to a functioning homestead? How do you get water, food, shelter, and the things attendant to them there when changing from a "city life" to a subsistence style of living somewhere remote from the usual location of "civilization"?

So, I ask you all, how many of you have made this fundamental change in the way you think, and live so that any major change in society will have minimal impact on your ability to live, and support your family?

I believe the two portions of Trim's long post that I've isolated, above, contain his basic question, Beekissed. (Of course, we should let him speak for himself.)

But it was a pretty long post... interesting for sure... easy to get lost in it.

That's not really a basic question....more a series of questions centered around, I think, how many people made a move to buy a piece of land and develop it into a homestead on which they can hunker down to weather "any major change in society".

I think it's expecting quite a bit to think that any major change in society won't impact a person's ability to live, no matter how much they think they've prepared for it. Especially anyone who starts out with the mindset that everything costs a staggering amount to convert a bare piece of land into a working homestead.

Of course it does if your picture of a homestead is neatly fenced land, off grid power sources in the form of solar, wind or hydro power, a nice home and an underground bunker with storage capabilities to stave off natural disasters, nuclear wars and world wide famine.

My parents did it with a chainsaw, some rough lumber, a tiller and lots of work. Somewhere in there an old '48 Case tractor was purchased and was still being used 30 years later. It took time to get buildings built from logs harvested on the land, roads were developed~ by hand~ so that a 4x4 vehicle could finally reach the property...even then it was an iffy prospect in bad weather. Monumental amounts of brush, multiflora rose, trees, old farm junk was removed from the tillable land, so hand tools were purchased(not new) for this endeavor.

All in all, the homestead was a few log structures~house, pole shed, animal shelters, cellar and an outhouse(not built of logs). None of these took a "staggering amount" of money to build, just time and hard work, a few hundred dollars in rough lumber for floors and roofs, some rolled roofing, etc.

Water source was an existing spring or two and an old hand dug well with a deep well hand pump on it. Again...not a staggering amount of money invested, even when a well was later drilled.

The point I'm trying to make is this: "Making the change" is relative and the reason so many don't ever make it is because they feel it will take a "staggering amount" of money to accomplish it and that everything needs to be so complete in order to homestead. It doesn't. You can still keep your job and homestead. You can live in basic log construction without the benefit of running water, solar power or any of the other frills and still homestead...AND keep your outside employment. It can take you years to accomplish and you can do it a little bit at a time, but you can still homestead.

It doesn't have to be this black or white scenario...homesteading is a work in progress. My parents "made the jump" but it doesn't really have to be a jump, as opposed to a slide or a step. Easing into it is more realistic for those who are so used to comfort, convenience and societal norms like running hot water, indoor plumbing, electric, cell phones, driveways that are short and paved or graveled.

 

[Hinotori]

I grew up in town, well what passes for town, since my Dad worked a government job. Mom always had us at Grandmas and my Great Aunts or other relatives out in the country since most of the family is farmers. I grew up around horses and chickens, cows, sheep and buffalo. My great Aunt even had some goats that I helped care for when I was staying with her. I always had to help Grandma change irrigation pipes and set gopher traps.

I went in the Navy after high school and married a guy I met while in. It didn't work out, but I still stayed in Virginia on the other side of the country for a while. Met another guy and we were married a few years later. My husband retired from the Navy in 2008 and we moved back to the west coast. Couldn't find a job by my parents, so we went a little farther west near Tacoma.

I'd been wanting to get back to a house with some land forever. I want some sheep and wanted chickens. 2010 we bought a little house on some land that we could actually afford. There are some issues and we do have marsh on the land, but the big pond that starts from the streams and marsh and goes on to the neighbors never goes dry, so if we had to, we could haul buckets. The dogs are always playing in the more shallow part on our property.

Last spring we got chickens, and put in a few fruit trees, blue berries, raspberries and blackberries. This year we are planning to put more fruit, and we bought the tiller last fall and will till and put in some garden plants. We also need to get some fencing up so I can get a few goats. We need them to help control some of the blackberries, roses, and brush. We're thinking of trying a few turkeys this year as well.

The wood stove needed replaced so we did that last year. We looked at the pellet stoves, but didn't want anything that uses electricity. We also have plenty of trees on the property and can get our own wood as needed. We're going to plant a few trees each year in some of the open space that the previous owner chopped trees down in. The house is 112 years old and only 900 sq ft so it doesn't take a ton of wood to heat it to comfortable for us.

The wood stove manufacturer says that the lower surface of the stove can be used for cooking, so I tried it one day. Made some great eggs and bacon. I also heat water on it regularly, so I'm pretty sure I could do other cooking on it with practice. I'll have to find some way to cook outside in summer, though, if we didn't have power.

So we are on our way to being a bit self sufficient. I keep a good pantry so we can go quite a while food wise. Just need seeds and that garden going to help a bit more.

 

[GhostRider65]

The QUESTION then becomes, how many folks have actually "taken the plunge since 2008"? I have read a lot of posts where folks say they are "hoping to get some land next year" or words to that effect, but the issue of getting a piece of land is paled in comparison to "what do you do with it once you have it?" The cost of EVERYTHING you need to convert a piece of bare land to a working homestead, particularly in this current economic situation is staggering. Yes, some folks do know how to scavenge and make things out of stuff they get free or really cheap, but the question still is do we really know/understand what it takes to convert a piece of bare land to a functioning homestead? How do you get water, food, shelter, and the things attendant to them there when changing from a "city life" to a subsistence style of living somewhere remote from the usual location of "civilization"?

So, I ask you all, how many of you have made this fundamental change in the way you think, and live so that any major change in society will have minimal impact on your ability to live, and support your family?

I believe the two portions of Trim's long post that I've isolated, above, contain his basic question, Beekissed. (Of course, we should let him speak for himself.)

But it was a pretty long post... interesting for sure... easy to get lost in it.

That's not really a basic question....more a series of questions centered around, I think, how many people made a move to buy a piece of land and develop it into a homestead on which they can hunker down to weather "any major change in society".

I think it's expecting quite a bit to think that any major change in society won't impact a person's ability to live, no matter how much they think they've prepared for it. Especially anyone who starts out with the mindset that everything costs a staggering amount to convert a bare piece of land into a working homestead.

Of course it does if your picture of a homestead is neatly fenced land, off grid power sources in the form of solar, wind or hydro power, a nice home and an underground bunker with storage capabilities to stave off natural disasters, nuclear wars and world wide famine.

My parents did it with a chainsaw, some rough lumber, a tiller and lots of work. Somewhere in there an old '48 Case tractor was purchased and was still being used 30 years later. It took time to get buildings built from logs harvested on the land, roads were developed~ by hand~ so that a 4x4 vehicle could finally reach the property...even then it was an iffy prospect in bad weather. Monumental amounts of brush, multiflora rose, trees, old farm junk was removed from the tillable land, so hand tools were purchased(not new) for this endeavor.

All in all, the homestead was a few log structures~house, pole shed, animal shelters, cellar and an outhouse(not built of logs). None of these took a "staggering amount" of money to build, just time and hard work, a few hundred dollars in rough lumber for floors and roofs, some rolled roofing, etc.

Water source was an existing spring or two and an old hand dug well with a deep well hand pump on it. Again...not a staggering amount of money invested, even when a well was later drilled.

The point I'm trying to make is this: "Making the change" is relative and the reason so many don't ever make it is because they feel it will take a "staggering amount" of money to accomplish it and that everything needs to be so complete in order to homestead. It doesn't. You can still keep your job and homestead. You can live in basic log construction without the benefit of running water, solar power or any of the other frills and still homestead...AND keep your outside employment. It can take you years to accomplish and you can do it a little bit at a time, but you can still homestead.

It doesn't have to be this black or white scenario...homesteading is a work in progress. My parents "made the jump" but it doesn't really have to be a jump, as opposed to a slide or a step. Easing into it is more realistic for those who are so used to comfort, convenience and societal norms like running hot water, indoor plumbing, electric, cell phones, driveways that are short and paved or graveled.

I'd have to agree here and this is what we plan on doing..a little here a bit more there... will I miss my electric? yes. I will miss a heated bathroom too ...OH yah an outhouse is still in my memory and when it was cold it was not pleasant, can I live without running water, lights and internet? Yup do it every time we go camping........ Will I like it maybe? I like the simpler things and long for the good old days when everything wasn't a convenient necessity. I hate that we have become so dependent on everything from the remote controls to super markets, it has made people lazy and dependent on the government or state, so many now days want to sit home do nothing but play video games and watch tv and collect a friggen pay check...... I have never understood how anyone can be happy doing nothing to improve there position.
My husbands X comes to mind so does mine........long stories but they live off everyone else including the tax payer, and government, food stamps, rental assistance, and a nice little pay check each month. it makes me sick. They could work but won't I haven't received any child support from my X in almost a year, is he in jail heck no, he should be..... but he';s actually trying to get a disability check because he fell down his steps drunk and hurt his knee, had surgery on the tax payer with MA and now wants a longer free ride because supposedly he can't work..he's 50 years old and has never held a job for more than 2 years, the usual is 3 months. What has become of the people who wanted to make a better life save alittle money eat fresh food not some nasty chemical laced fast garbage.....womene knew how to cook, now a days very few cook, my son ewas taught but prefers MCD's spends about 500 dollars every 2 weeks on fast food, there always broke and when I mention the crap they eat, I'm an crazy woman who doesn't get it? seriously who doesn't get it.......... that generation is all like that spend spend and dig yourself a hoel so deep Satan is your neighbor.......
I think anyone should know that time and work will always pay off, but everyone seems to have lost there common sense, thats why everyone thinks that a homestead is not attainable, it isn't a convenient quick move, and everyone wants instant gratification these days. Kim

 

[~gd]

I made the complete opposite change many years ago. I grew up on a subsistence farm and lived that life until I was 13. Big old house, 7 bedrooms, O baths, No running water, heated by two wood stoves. Got so cold in the winters of western NY that the chamber pots would freeze. Two water sources, the rain from the roof was collected in a cistern in the cellar and could be pumped up by a simple manual pump for washing, cleaning etc. Drinking water was available about 150 yards from the house. If you were lucky the windmill would be working and you just had to throw the manual pump into gear, catch the water in suitable containers and lug it to the house. We got a new wagon or sled every year but they were not toys! Of course the stock had to drink too about 50 gallons /day, more when it was hot. Each stroke of that big old pump handle delivered one quart of cold fresh water, we loved it when the wind was blowing we would connect the pipe [old downspouts] and fill the stock tank.
The barn was typical, common barnyard in the middle of a group of stock houses, stables where we kept the team, Milk house/cow shelter. Pig house, sheep house. Small houses for the bull, the boar, and the Ram, and of course the henhouse. There was a series of gates to get the right stock to the right pasture. On one side of the compound the earth was formed into a ramp that would allow us to get hay and grain into the 2nd floor storage [a tin lined granary and two huge haymows]. Everything was arranged so you could feed all the animals from the second floor. The main barn was Post and Timber framed the posts were 12x12 and all held together by wooden pins. Closer to the house was the carriage house [shop] Smoke house, Ice house and Outhouse [Tightly made 3 hole with a working window and two vent pipes through the roof.
If you havent figured it out yet there was no power or phone but was on a paved road. A homesteaders dream home right? When the widow that owned the place up and died when I was 13 my father got a job with a corporate farm. He called us together and said. Your days of working on this farm are over. Remember it and if you ever consider taking up farming for a living and I hear of it I will give you a good boot in the rear! You are all smart and there are many ways of earning a living with your brain rather than your back We took that to heart, we all managed to get an education. My brother got a PhD and was a professor of Entomology at an Ag college in MO, one sister became a Nurse in NY the other a Teacher in CO and I became a Chemist ending in NC. I joined this SS board because I thought I could help, mostly I have just made people mad, they dont want to hear it, they think I am talking down to them, so screw it! I will only post if someone asks for me specifically and I can always be reached by PM. Have a good life and Bless your Hearts! ~gd out

 

[luvinlife offthegrid]

Ok sure, I'll bite.

I generally watch this thread topic because for all the things that we SS-er's do, it seems that some form of preparation for a change is part of our overarching psyche. Whether we are prepared for serious weather (like we had for the past two winters here in SDAK) or serious hurricanes such as they had on the east coast or a Katrina like scenario, the idea of living a lifestyle that will be the least affected by any such change always seems to be in the back of our minds. What is interesting is that this topic seems to have become less and less interesting to folks here than before. I know we have a lot of new folks who may have different ideas, but the change in interest seems to be rather profound in my opinion.

My emergency preparedness has to do with my driveway being so long. When I had to walk out of here once- the snow was above my knees. Not easy to walk for any distance, much less the 7/10 of a mile that is my driveway. I stock up just in case I'm stranded. Or for bad weather. Or for other natural disasters.

Given the economic situation of the globe at the moment (France and Germany are desperately attempting to "save" the Euro) many of the posts I have read over the past several years have been by folks who have either lost faith in our current system or have decided that they just don't like being THAT dependent on others to such an extent that if they were unable to work for whatever reason, their livlihood would NOT be decimated, particularly if they have children to feed, clothe and educate.

I live in an area on the outskirts of town where there are families that each excel at something different. A guy a few miles from me (but a ten minute walk over the hill) raises cows and pigs for food. I have chickens. and guns. Heck, I think we all do. We all know basic building skills. There are people with sugar maples. I know how to make bread, make candles, etc etc. Not sure where we'd get wheat from though, so there goes the bread, but it's making us fat anyway so I guess ftuits and veggies and fresh meats and nuts would do us all good.

I would love to know how to render fat to get wax to MAKE candles, but that's a skill for another day. I mean- if something happens, and I can't get to the craft store to get the wax, I won't be making many candles. But I am not going to use all my spare time (I work full time) preparing for something that may or may not happen in my lifetime. and I am not going to quit my job to do it.

There are some skills I have that my neighbors don't. But I will tell you, that if something does happen, my "neighborhood" wil be a strong force and will be able to help one another. We already do.

Additionally, there are a number of issues that make life more gratifying when undertaken by the SS type of personality. In prior posts, I have noticed that there are a significant number of us here who have been the product of parents who lived through the great depression. We were taught to take care of what we had, and not to be cavalier with things just because they make millions of them in China. I remember my father thinking that you should only have to buy something one time. It should work when you buy it and for ever thereafter, it should be carefully maintained so that it did work for the remainder of your life. We all know that this philosophy does NOT coincide with the industrial giants who think we should just use it for a brief period (maybe only once) and then throw it away and buy another one from them. Most of us here would probably be annoyed with that philosophy and that would cause many of us to avoid such a product, buy a much better made one (if that exists), make one ourselves or just go without it.

I would rather spend 4 times the amount for something that had a modular design that I could order the parts and fix myself, but things just aren't like that anymore. The waste sickens me.

Considering that, I wonder how many folks here have actually made the change from the "city" to the "country" and/or have become "homesteaders" in either an urban environment or sub-urban environment? Why did you do it? Was it because it was "fun to do" or because it was "less expensive" or because it was a way to "stretch your resources" or was it a way to "utilize your creativity" in order to see whether or not you could adjust to a lower degree of technological life style (either because you might have to; or might just want to)?

I've always grown up in the country. When I was about 20, I moved to Long Island. I looked around and absorbed the rat race, which was only vaguely present in the lives of folks where I live. I saw people striving for more and more material things and money. And none of it seemed valuable to me. I just kept observing. Then one day, I was observing what "they" do as humans and suddenly the human race and how it lives in cities and suburban areas seemed like a giant ant farm. I had to get the hell out of there. I decided that I wouldn't be part of that humanity, and I haven't been ever since. Maybe I never was? To me, life isn't about manicures and BMW's and physical beauty. I returned to rural life in 1996. Now don't get me wrong, I like my tv and my ipad. I just use it as it should be used: as entertainment when my work is done.

Even more interesting is the question of how many have done it since 2008, knowing as we do that the economy can NOT sustain the behavior that we have seen in the past. We have seen the "Occupy___" as a statement by folks who for whatever reason think they are being "wronged" by all corporations or can't get a job fully realizing that there really is plenty of work in this country but they feel that they have graduated from some college which makes them "too good" to do labor that will bring in a paycheck but they actually have to use their back to get the work done? I have heard and seen plenty of places in our country who are hiring folks from other country's, (Mexico comes to mind) where the folks there WILL do hard work for a check and think they are making a huge salary compared with what they could have made in their own home.

As you said in the bit I edited out, The economy is changing. The world is changing. It will be interesting to see how it changes. Human societies, governments, ways of life, leaders, cultures, have had cycles of change and stability since humans have been around. One thing is certain, is that it will always change. I accept and embrace it. IMO, To fight it would be futile. The pendulum will always swing.

The fact of the matter is that I made the big change earlier in life in my own mind and as I became closer to retirement with the Navy, I did a little more at each location to become more self-sufficient. The place I lived in Virginia was my last duty station where I built a 30 x 36 two story horse barn and riding ring. When I say I built it, I mean just that. On rare occasion, I had a friend come over and give me a hand with a few things like heavy lifting or bulky work and sometimes just repetetive work such as screwing plywood to the rafters for flooring. However, in each of these locations, I continued to feel the "pinch" of the need to be more and more self-sufficient so that if the economy did collapse like it did in 1929, the effect on my life would be minimized in terms of the basic necessities, food, shelter, clean water and some form of power.

Being able to build something from nothing is a valuable skill. Having the (non-electric) tools and the ability to follow basic instructions from a book- or the intelligence to build something WITHOUT isntructions is really something. That's not common like it used to be.

Admittedly, power was the least necessary and the most rapidly vulnerable at the time because a generator that runs on gasoline will NOT run when the gasoline is either too hard to get or too precious to waste. Bringing water up out of the well with the generator was considered a priority but then if the gasoline became impossible to get, the well could have all the water in the world but none of it was coming up to see me.

This is why we still have an outhouse, a wood cookstove, and a bucket and turnstile(or whatever it's called) to get water from the well. We have a hand pump we could easily install if we should ever have to collect rainwater for whatever purpose. Originally, the house had a concrete-lined cistern(sp) hooked up to a roof gutter system for doing the dishes. It could easily be hooked up again, but those rubber gaskets for the hand pumps dry up after time. I lived here without electricity for a year. I could do a camp shower if I had to, but I went my mom's house 2 miles away a LOT for showers then. How running water is the most underappreciated "modern convenience" in my opinion. I still don't have a clothes washer. Thank god for laundrymats. I wouldn't want to have to do wash by hand. I wonder how i'd get lye from the stove ashes to make soap... I have a book about that somewhere...

The QUESTION then becomes, how many folks have actually "taken the plunge since 2008"? I have read a lot of posts where folks say they are "hoping to get some land next year" or words to that effect, but the issue of getting a piece of land is paled in comparison to "what do you do with it once you have it?" The cost of EVERYTHING you need to convert a piece of bare land to a working homestead, particularly in this current economic situation is staggering. Yes, some folks do know how to scavenge and make things out of stuff they get free or really cheap, but the question still is do we really know/understand what it takes to convert a piece of bare land to a functioning homestead? How do you get water, food, shelter, and the things attendant to them there when changing from a "city life" to a subsistence style of living somewhere remote from the usual location of "civilization"?

I think it's just different. It's all relative. To me, it's a lot "harder" to work every waking moment to get that really great house, car, promotion, social connection, etc to keep up with the Jones'. By comparison, splitting firewood with a maul and a wedge- or grabbing a bucket and hauling water 5 gallons at a time- is easy. I know, without money nothing is easy. But I feel confident that with the help of our community, we could get through in a REALLY tough time.

I can say from my own perspective that I got a nice place that had all kinds of good buildings on it, and it is fenced in places, etc. but the amount of work to keep it working properly and adequately maintained (because of many years of neglect) and to make advances in self-sufficiency have been astronomical in cost. Admittedly, I moved to an area considered by the majority of folks to be "really remote" where the cost of living is presumed to be "lower". Unfortunately, the cost of goods and services is much higher because of the remote nature of my world. Fortunately, my resources have been sufficient to meet the demand because I have a "marketable" skill which provides me with a cash flow. Otherwise, I would never have been able to do what I have done to this farm. It is just too costly.

I don't think I could ever expand my property and whatever it's called, to what would be considered a "homestead", even though it's very close to being there already. I just simply don't want large livestock. For a while we could hunt wild game. I'm pretty confortable with that. It's easier for us to let the deer do the work of raising itself. But the game population would dwindle quickly if everyone were hunting. And let's face it, people would steal the livestock- Unless we had endles resources to defend it.

In one string of posts, folks liked the idea of a "commune" but rapidly found out that they had absolutely NO desire to live in such an environment, either because of their refusal to compromise their independence or their preference to NOT have to deal with other people primarily caused by the inability of folks to work together for a common goal. As long as the idea of a "community" that was planned stayed "virtual" folks thought it was a cute idea and liked to "play along". When they thought (even for a moment) that such a planned experience would be a real issue, they immediately put all kinds of "road-blocks" in that made it impossible to actually do, similar to "herding cats", particulary if they would have been required to make a serious investment of their own resources in order to a) create the place and b) operate it. Even looking at it like being part of a corporation as such was completely unpleasant for many of them and the reactions to such an idea were quite interesting.

Heheheh. I must have missed that one. I already have an agreement with a few people. They are all doing this while connected to the grid. Our house is the only one in the area still capable of doing anything without electricity.
Community exists, it's just different now.

You probably got tired of reading this so if you did stick it out to the end, good on ya! As Benjamin Franklin said so eloquently, "If we all do not hang together, we will assuredly all hang separately." I for one intend to do what I can to preserve what we have because if we don't, it will assuredly disappear before our very eyes and that includes our freedom!

Trim sends
http://www.sufficientself.com/forum/uploads/1808_images.jpeg
//BT//

I read the whole post but I am not going to suggest that I have the answers to the things that plague humanity as a whole, or our country's societal system. I agree with some of what you said but not everything. My signature and my posts here give enough info on my POV.

 

[ladyride]

first time poster here long time on byc.
me and my other wanted to get out of the rat race and other problems we found 3.5 acres grow 90% of our vegs have chickens .
looking to have goats grapes and fruit trees soon . due to health wanted to get more back to earth hated all the chemicals in food .
didnt think to call it home steading but i guess thats what it is . i also think TSHTF is coming hope it wont be to bad i know the people sitting at home collecting arent gonna like it dont care.
gd i under stand where your coming from the same thing happened on byc to a lot of old timers some quit posting i hope you dont . it always makes me mad when someone asks for advice and its given but since it dont fit there notion of instant gratification you have no idea what your talking about.

 

[GhostRider65]

I made the complete opposite change many years ago. I grew up on a subsistence farm and lived that life until I was 13. Big old house, 7 bedrooms, O baths, No running water, heated by two wood stoves. Got so cold in the winters of western NY that the chamber pots would freeze. Two water sources, the rain from the roof was collected in a cistern in the cellar and could be pumped up by a simple manual pump for washing, cleaning etc. Drinking water was available about 150 yards from the house. If you were lucky the windmill would be working and you just had to throw the manual pump into gear, catch the water in suitable containers and lug it to the house. We got a new wagon or sled every year but they were not toys! Of course the stock had to drink too about 50 gallons /day, more when it was hot. Each stroke of that big old pump handle delivered one quart of cold fresh water, we loved it when the wind was blowing we would connect the pipe [old downspouts] and fill the stock tank.
The barn was typical, common barnyard in the middle of a group of stock houses, stables where we kept the team, Milk house/cow shelter. Pig house, sheep house. Small houses for the bull, the boar, and the Ram, and of course the henhouse. There was a series of gates to get the right stock to the right pasture. On one side of the compound the earth was formed into a ramp that would allow us to get hay and grain into the 2nd floor storage [a tin lined granary and two huge haymows]. Everything was arranged so you could feed all the animals from the second floor. The main barn was Post and Timber framed the posts were 12x12 and all held together by wooden pins. Closer to the house was the carriage house [shop] Smoke house, Ice house and Outhouse [Tightly made 3 hole with a working window and two vent pipes through the roof.
If you havent figured it out yet there was no power or phone but was on a paved road. A homesteaders dream home right? When the widow that owned the place up and died when I was 13 my father got a job with a corporate farm. He called us together and said. Your days of working on this farm are over. Remember it and if you ever consider taking up farming for a living and I hear of it I will give you a good boot in the rear! You are all smart and there are many ways of earning a living with your brain rather than your back We took that to heart, we all managed to get an education. My brother got a PhD and was a professor of Entomology at an Ag college in MO, one sister became a Nurse in NY the other a Teacher in CO and I became a Chemist ending in NC. I joined this SS board because I thought I could help, mostly I have just made people mad, they dont want to hear it, they think I am talking down to them, so screw it! I will only post if someone asks for me specifically and I can always be reached by PM. Have a good life and Bless your Hearts! ~gd out

Sounds like my dream farm, wish I could have it moved here........... I bet you learned a great deal about life though on that there farm. I think that's half of whats wrong with society today, none of them are willing to put forth any effort at all to live, everyone wants someones to do all the work while they laze around playing video games and watching tv with the remote in there pocket. TY for the post I think you should post more I found nothing offensive with it and I like to hear other peoples stories, especially on this subject. Kim